2023 World Championship Event Finals Day 2 MAG VT/PB/HB & WAG BB/FX (Sunday 10/08)

[YurchenkoLoop]

What do you mean “to justify her selection”?

Beam was her only contribution to the team and the Dutch left a DTY behind. Beam is an unreliable event, so Wevers needed to prove her consistency and she definitely did

 

[ArnoldRimmer]

I got almost all my wishes. I would have liked Schaefer-Betz to get a beam medal. Do we know if the triple L was credited for anyone?

Yeah I was a bit gutted about that too. Would’ve loved to see Pauline pick up some more hardware. The way she moves on beam is gorgeous.

 

[IratePanda]

Qiu Qiyuan and Zhou Yaqin made my week. My month. My year, even! For the first time since 2014 (?!), stanning China doesn’t feel like a form of self-harm.

I’m also thrilled for the entire Brazilian team, but especially for Andrade and Saraiva. Their resilience is so inspiring.

 

[Aeris]

Andrade wins this floor final for me. Better form on the leaps, better landings, better movement quality and musicality. Even if Simone had been credited on the gogean (it was further around this time and always would have been credited like this in the past), Andrade still wins the execution tiebreaker on my scoresheet.

In the beam final I felt they finally got Simone’s E-score right, but Zhou Yaqin still was better. It’s very questionable how when Simone is in danger of losing, Zhou is suddenly not credited with a connection she’s been given every other time. There wasn’t excessive pause, knee bend, hip flex, foot movement, or arm wave after her Side Somi compared to every other time she’s done the connection. The panel took .3 away from her on a whim. That would have been the first 15.0 beam score of this quad otherwise.

 

[RAFIKI]

I felt like Simone was in concentration mode today. She seemed more into her floor in previous rounds of the competition. The routine has grown on me since Classics. I wouldn’t mind if she kept it for next year but she tends to change. On that subject I wonder if Jessica will keep hers for Euros? I get the impression she likes to know when the last time she competes a routine will be and her injury robbed her of that here.

I too thought that there was an argument for Zhou Yaqin to win beam. Will be interesting to watch that back.

 

[Denn]

I hadn’t realized what happened with Zhou Yagin. Can you do a breakdown do her beam D-scores with the video? Sounds… bad.

 

[Aeris]

I hadn’t realized what happened with Zhou Yagin. Can you do a breakdown do her beam D-scores with the video? Sounds… bad.

It all comes down to the Side Somi + Tuck 1/1 connection. If it’s not credited she loses .2 for the D+D connection and .1 series bonus. They gave it to her every other time, for the same kind of execution. I’d say she took slightly longer to set her 2nd foot down on the Side Somi this time, but that shouldn’t matter, the connection shouldn’t be judged until the point where the first skill ends.

I love how much Christine Still is uncontrollable gushing over this rountine:

 

[Caligym]

It all comes down to the Side Somi + Tuck 1/1 connection. If it’s not credited she loses .2 for the D+D connection and .1 series bonus. They gave it to her every other time, for the same kind of execution. I’d say she took slightly longer to set her 2nd foot down on the Side Somi this time, but that shouldn’t matter, the connection shouldn’t be judged until the point where the first skill ends.

I love how much Christine Still is uncontrollable gushing over this rountine:

Zhou had a 6.4 D in qualifying, 6.6 in team final and 6.5 in event finals. Did she miss other connections in event final? You are saying she should have had 6.8?

 

[Aeris]

Zhou had a 6.4 D in qualifying, 6.6 in team final and 6.5 in event finals. Did she miss other connections in event final? You are saying she should have had 6.8?

Yes she went to 6.8 with this routine. In qualifying she didn’t do the Straight 1/1 jump after the Tuck 1/1 (.2 loss) and in both qualifying and team final she didn’t connect the Split jump out of the Front Tuck (.2 loss).

 

[CameliasFingerpaint]

That Side somi and tuck jump was in no way whatsoever connected.

The quality of her elements are sublime, but its riddled with pauses (I hate the pause rule, but it’s been around for a decade now) and the choreography is so uninspired. Based on the code as written, the ranking makes sense to me.

 

[Aeris]

That Side somi and tuck jump was in no way whatsoever connected.

It was credited every other time, with no significant difference here. Doing two skills within that space of time and having no foot slide or excessive arm swing, hip flex, or extra knee bend is a connection. This one looks slightly slower because her side somi takes longer to end, but that shouldn’t be held against her. It’s even commentated how the side somi floats down onto the beam.

 

[RichardL]

That Side somi and tuck jump was in no way whatsoever connected.

The quality of her elements are sublime, but its riddled with pauses (I hate the pause rule, but it’s been around for a decade now) and the choreography is so uninspired. Based on the code as written, the ranking makes sense to me.

The pauses and preparation are just insane throughout this routine. The coaches have read the COP and they still have her perform like this? She should be an absolute slam dunk beam champion. The Chinese are approaching GAGE-level mis-management of their athletes’ strengths.

 

[Kara]

That Side somi and tuck jump was in no way whatsoever connected.

The quality of her elements are sublime, but its riddled with pauses (I hate the pause rule, but it’s been around for a decade now) and the choreography is so uninspired. Based on the code as written, the ranking makes sense to me.

Agreed, no way should that connection get credit. Personally, I prefer the skill selection in Zhou’s routine to Biles, but she’s getting killed in pause deductions.

 

[Aeris]

It’s not possible to make everyone go fast enough to avoid every pause deduction, unless the routines are stripped down of the most difficult skills and combos. Simone’s routine has 2 “unnecessary step” and 2 pause deductions, and she moves generally very fast. Zhou’s routine has 4 pauses, but if that’s what’s needed to do high quality combos and dismounts, it’s worthwhile. Her routine can score 15.0+, it’s not like the tactic is failing.

The Japanese routines are structured to avoid those deductions but they aren’t even scoring higher on execution, while taking hits on the D-score. Maybe that can be called an error, but depending on E-score hasn’t proven to be reliable. Urara Ashikawa’s routine would deserve to win the bronze here but she was only given the 5th-best E-score.

 

[YurchenkoLoop]

Candle C
FHS + FT + sj + wolf BDBA .4
Switch ring E
Somi + tuck jump 1/1 DD .2
Straight 1/1 C
Turn A
Free walkover + ring jump + Korbut DDB .4
3.0 F
FDDDCEDD 3.4 + 2.2 + 1.0 = 6.6

The D score is correct. Had she taken out the straight jump 1/1 after missing the connection, she would’ve scored at least a 14.800 because she wobbled on the skill

 

[Aeris]

She was given 6.5D, not 6.6. The tuck + straight jump was credited, as it should be. If she knew the side somi + tuck wouldn’t be credited and she’d no longer get series bonus for the straight jump, then yeah she probably should have taken it out, but people don’t know as they are performing how everything will be called. The rules are very frustrating and unfair to the gymnasts.

 

[Denn]

@Aeris I agree. It would be better to award the attempted connection value, avoiding all these surprises and debates, and let the E-panel decide how much of it to take bacl based on the execution of what was attempted. If an E-panel judge feels it was a slow connection, they can take –0.1 out of the 0.2; if they think it was no connection, –0.2. And their opinions get averaged into the E-score.

 

[YurchenkoLoop]

She was given 6.5D, not 6.6. The tuck + straight jump was credited, as it should be. If she knew the side somi + tuck wouldn’t be credited and she’d no longer get series bonus for the straight jump, then yeah she probably should have taken it out, but people don’t know as they are performing how everything will be called. The rules are very frustrating and unfair to the gymnasts.

You’re right, they credited the tuck jump 1/1 + straight jump 1/1, but not the somi + tuck jump 1/1… Weird. I thought the earlier connection was far better than that second one

 

[Caledi]

It all comes down to the Side Somi + Tuck 1/1 connection. If it’s not credited she loses .2 for the D+D connection and .1 series bonus. They gave it to her every other time, for the same kind of execution. I’d say she took slightly longer to set her 2nd foot down on the Side Somi this time, but that shouldn’t matter, the connection shouldn’t be judged until the point where the first skill ends.

It’s not even close to connected. She very clearly lifts her arms upwards after fully landing the side somi to prep for the tuck full. There was a FIG video about this where that sort of motion was given as an example of when not to credit a connection.

 

[CameliasFingerpaint]

I agree. It would be better to award the attempted connection value, avoiding all these surprises and debates, and let the E-panel decide how much of it to take bacl based on the execution of what was attempted. If an E-panel judge feels it was a slow connection, they can take –0.1 out of the 0.2; if they think it was no connection, –0.2. And their opinions get averaged into the E-score.

Where does the line get drawn, though?

I’m with you on not downgrading actual intended elements and deducting from the e-score instead, but connections still need an absolute line in the sand regarding what is and what isn’t a connection. Sure, you could relax the rules and introduce a 0.3 deduction for poor rhythm in a connection, but I’m not sure that will solve the problem of all these nebulous awarding of connections.