US Classic Senior Session 2

[glamafonic]

I thought that he said if she qualified an individual place she would be ineligible for a team spot? Has that changed? If he’s recanted on that, then yes that is clearly a bad decision.

He said that but at no point in the two plus years after Jade announced her intention did he or anyone else with influence over selection procedures actually put that in the rules, so it means nothing.

Also his ability to just take the top AAers from selection camps and still have good results is owed in no small part to Simone’s existence. I don’t think the gymnasts not being scared of him is at all an issue (obviously they shouldn’t be), but his apparent lack of input on obviously poorly constructed routines and questionable strategic planning is.

I mostly feel like there have been some obvious things that he should have done as NTC but didn’t and nothing he has done that pretty much anyone couldn’t have (e.g. look at AA rank from a selection camp). Of course for all I know maybe USAG doesn’t want him to ever make any actual decisions so that no one can complain.

 

[YurchenkoLoop]

All that ^^^^^^^ and also the Morgan falling on a toe-on and not being chosen despite her repeatedly proven and very apparent abilities x

 

[glamafonic]

Yeah, see leaving the reigning World AA bronze medalist off the team because of a fluke mistake is some of that questionable strategic planning. And since the team still won and you still had Simone there to win every individual final but one all by herself, it’s easy not to split hairs about whether maybe Morgan, in place of Grace or Kara, could’ve actually won an individual medal as well.

It’s the sort of thing that’s not an issue now because of the depth and the Simone Factor, but easily could become an issue in the future once a bunch of these gymnasts retire and/or the US has another lean year like say 2014 without the Simone buffer.

 

[irichluck21]

Forster has also been LUCKY to have Simone back. While the US would still have won in 2018 and 2019 without her, having Biles gives a huge advantage to the team. Even if she falls her scores are fine to count into team total due to extreme difficulty. When she hits VT and FX, (which she always does) her scores on those two events give a large buffer.

Biles also goes up on all 4 in team finals so with 4 other athletes doing all around, it isn’t a challenge to pick 16 other routines from the 4 other athletes.

When Simone retires it now presents a new challenge and it will be interesting to see how it goes.
These days with data collection, it isn’t a problem to not just go from straight AA results. The highest scoring team can easily be found with even basic computer programs. As long as he is transparent about the rationale to choosing the team it should be fine. Marta was not transparent and that is where the issue was.

In terms of Forster with the Carey scenario, he likely stated that and probably felt that was the right decision. But it is clear that USAG Board and Li Li Leung felt differently.

 

[L_R]

My team would be Simone, Shilese, Jordan and Konnor.

 

[irichluck21]

Shilese?
What on Earth?

 

[RedBirdie]

Konnor? I wouldn’t take her to worlds right now. She’s a mess.

 

[lovegymnasts]

Think this is more of a dream team vs realistic

 

[crdubb17]

Shilese has always been my sentimental fave this quad, but unfortunately her routine construction is poor and she never hits said routines.

 

[L_R]

She hit at the winter Cup and she has more difficulty in the bag. Her gymnastics has now matured and looking better than ever. At this stage I’d much prefer to watch her than a few of the other front runners.

 

[KorbutFan]

L_R wasn’t exactly going to put a white or Asian gymnast on the team.

 

[L_R]

If Suni was fit and hitting she’d be second on my team , as would Grace .

 

[06gymnast]

I’m sorry I missed it but could someone tell me who qualified/petitioned to nationals?

 

[RedBirdie]

Qualifiers are here: Qualifiers to US Nationals

Unknown who has petitioned, let alone been accepted.

 

[lovegymnasts]

Honestly, right now, Suni is not on my team (definitely not on the main team).
Reason being, she hasn’t hit her new routine once in competition (winter or classics) and she’s struggling with stamina. I can hopefully see it changing by trials but as of today, no.

 

[crdubb17]

I agree, she’s matured beautifully, but it really hasn’t translated into her E score on beam or floor to where she’s competitive enough to be in the top 4. I wish the choreography on floor worked better (maybe she just needs to commit to it more), but I cringe watching it. I feel like she could be right there with Chiles in the 56-57 range if she were able to consistently hit her routines (dance elements included) and came with the proper upgrades (double double on floor, full-in on beam, etc).

I would love for @Doug1233 @Denn to come up with some modified routines for her on beam and floor. Not much can be altered for beam, but I would probably shoot for a three pass floor (Jones+stag, DLO, double double) and keep her dance with the addition of a popa or strug. I think she would still need a front flipping skill, but I don’t know if she could handle anymore than her current routine. It would be cool if the Jones satisfied that requirement (it looks almost like a 1.5 in, front out). I feel she’s getting hammered for her landings and feet on the last two passes.

 

[MRR]

Her 6.5 set is still the best bar routine the U.S. has, by far. It was hit at Winter Cup and American Classic.

Now if she’s incapable of tumbling or vaulting by Trials and can’t hit beam, that’s another matter. But bars alone isn’t keeping her off.

 

[lovegymnasts]

Bars is why most people have her on their team despite not being able to vault, not doing floor, and not being consistent on beam. I will rewatch winter and classics for her bars after work but I remember issues with both and a clear indication of lack of stamina.

 

[ArnoldRimmer]

Definitely. If she can still get through that set, it’ll be worth taking her. The US don’t need the rest.

 

[Doug1233]

It seems like, from 2019 to 2021, she’s downgraded a ton:





Given her huge DLO, you’d hope that she could do Chuso, Silivas, Double Arabian to stag, L Hop 1/1 to Switch Side 1/2, Double L to Double Turn. Popa. HHE1CCD1BC = 5.8. Compare to the 5.4 in 2019 and 5.3 in 2021.

Nix the Double Tuck entirely. Unless you’re one of the Chinese doing it with knees pasted together, toes pointed, and stuck, it’s just not worth doing.

I would personally remove the “Jones”. There are other passes that would score way more. It’s not a front salto so she wouldn’t get CR for it. She probably can’t jump out of it. And going by her 2021 routine, she clearly doesn’t have the stamina to put it at the end of her exercise.