Russia-Ukraine War: Effects on Gymn World

[Rich]

It seems like Russia would be able to compete at the olympics [“The Russian athletes certainly did not start the war. Those who have distanced themselves from the regime should be able to compete under a neutral flag.” Thomas Bach, IOC President

 

[Doug1233]

Those who have distanced themselves from the regime

So Listunova and Urazova showing up at a pro war rally wouldn’t fall within this exception?

As far as I know, Melnikova hasn’t said anything or done anything. I wouldn’t mind her attending under the Olympic (not ROC) flag.

 

[JDB]

I noticed no quotes about Russia’s need for systemic sports reform. He’s fine with the rest of the world bearing the burden of a single country’s participation.

2024 Paris Olympic Games

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[Doug1233]

It seems like everyone has forgotten about the widespread Russian doping scandal and all the focus is now on whether you are pro- or anti-war.

Essentially, Russians will need to leave Russia to meet both the requirements of being vocally anti-war AND subject to international drug testing standards. I think it’s impossible to stay training in Russia and satisfy both of those requirements.

 

[MaryClare]

Melnikova and several others from the national teams were on a float at victory day parade this year.

The IOC may well make it technically possible for Russian athletes to compete in Paris but the bigger issue will be the qualification criteria for different sports, which are set by the individual governing bodies. For many sports it may not be possible to qualify.

I am very much against the exclusion of any country from international sport for political or humanitarian reasons. On those grounds, the Soviet Union should probably never have been allowed to compete until the late 80s. Sport played a huge role in the de-escalation and then end of the Cold War.

Regarding Listunova and Urazova attending the rally, it is likely to be ignored when applying that criteria- how can you reasonably expect children to distance themselves from the government. If anything, it makes it more likely they’ll be viewed as victims of the regime.

 

[Doug1233]

how can you reasonably expect children to distance themselves from the government

Not even just children.

 

[MaryClare]

You’ve had some pretty crazy takes before, this is possibly the craziest. Therefore it’s probably best that I don’t take it seriously

 

[JDB]

Istanbul is the new host for the FIG congress. Ukraine, Norway, Poland, and Estonia plan to boycott.

https://www.insidethegames.biz/articles/1128766/poland-boycott-fig

 

[irichluck21]

Istanbul is the new host for the FIG congress. Ukraine, Norway, Poland, and Estonia plan to boycott.

https://www.insidethegames.biz/articles/1128766/poland-boycott-fig

Hopefully many more countries will follow suit.
If GBR and USA lead the way, this will hopefully push for more countries to join the boycott and hopefully convince FIG to change their minds.

 

[Doug1233]

Are these officials representing RUS or BLR, or are they representing the FIG without affiliation to their respective NOC?

It’s a difficult one, for me. For example, China and North Korea are, in plain sight, committing active genocide against their own citizens, but presumably they are welcomed to the Congress. Where should we draw the line? I guess we are concluding that intentional killing of citizens of other countries is more of an afront to the international order than the intentional killing of one’s own citizens. That may be so. But of course both are revolting.

 

[MaryClare]

As I have said before. If you think Russian nationals should be cancelled from everything because of the actions of the government, but not calling for the same for China, you are massively naïve. Same goes for the Soviet Union. Shouldn’t have ever been allowed to compete or hold any positions in any international organisation

 

[JDB]

These boycotts aren’t punitive efforts. Boycotting competitions with Russian participants is appropriate for most Olympic sports. Russian institutions reward pro-war behavior and Ukrainian athletes shouldn’t bear Russia’s burden at competitions. Russia needs internal reform before they can be let back even as unaffiliated athletes.

My opinion on this boycott of Russian & Belarusian participation in congress is more mixed. But I think, “Ukraine shouldn’t bear Russia’s burden,” still applies. Morinari Watanabe should take Ukraine joining the boycott as a hint. But he won’t.

 

[Caligym]

Policing what nations do to their own citizens within their own borders is always a thorny issue. Virtually EVERY nation has its own history of injustice. But crossing borders into other nations is a red line that virtually the entire world agrees cannot be allowed to be crossed. If a nation cannot respect the boundaries of other nations, they should not be a part of the international community.

 

[Doug1233]

Yes I think that’s why there’s the distinction here.

 

[Caligym]

It is not simply naïveté. We can’t stand by and allow a country to participate in the world community with no consequences after invading another nation. We could be next. What happens within a country like China does not affect us. So while it may be massively selfish and cruel to ignore what is happening in China, I would not write it off as naive.

 

[irichluck21]

The United States boycotted the 1980 Olympics over the Soviet Union invading Afghanistan on December 27th, 1979. So this has happened before. The IOC contemplated moving the Olympics, but there was not enough time to do so, as the Olympics opened on July 21, 1980. With roughly 6 and half months before the Olympics there was no way they could be moved with that limited notice.

Additionally, the US and other countries almost boycotted the 1936 Olympics due to Hitler’s stance on black people and of course Jewish people. However it didn’t happen as many people pointed out that it was hypocrisy of the US to boycott the games when the US allowed discriminatory practices to black Americans including segregation and the Jim Crow laws in the southern states. The motion to compete in Berlin just barely passed at the AAU and the US competed. In a way it was best that this happened because Jesse Owens showed up and dominated track, which was huge blow to Hitler’s ego and led to Hitler refusing to shake hands with Owens and before Owens, Cornelius Johnson, another black US track athlete won the high jump. This was Hitler’s first refusal, however Hitler had shaken the hands of the German and Finnish athletes that had won gold. The IOC stated that Hitler had to shake hands with all athletes or no athletes at all. Hitler chose not to honor any athletes because he could not bare to shake the hands of black or Jewish athletes that had won gold medals.

As was stated earlier, it is hard to challenge human rights issues in specific countries. The exception was of banning South Africa for Apartheid from 1964-1988. However, this practice was widely known around the world and South Africa made it very well known that they were practicing racial segregation and refused to allow black athletes to compete in national sport, so there was some ground to stand on in terms of the IOC being able to act on this due to the United Nations condemning South Africa for Apartheid in 1962 and refusal to allow black athletes to compete for the country.

 

[FrolovasDoubleLayout]

Morinari Watanabe should take Ukraine joining the boycott as a hint. But he won’t.

It should have been that not only coaches, athletes and officials should have been banned, but also any RUS or BLR individual who is on ANY committee. To be nominated and elected to any of these positions, your name has to be put forth BY your federation so therefore you ARE a representative of your federation. What makes your position any more important than the athlete and coach and official - they are who are needed to have any successful competition.

 

[JaJa]

Yes, of course that’s the distinction. It’s about the fundamental notion of state sovereignty and the idea that nation-states do not interfere in the affairs of other nation-states which must be protected from hostile intervention of other nations.

 

[dweiss324]

^ If I hadn’t had the context of this thread, I would have automatically assumed you were referring to the US…

 

[MaryClare]

How does China not affect you but Russia does? That is absolute naivety

Also, are you aware that there are several countries in the world committing humanitarian atrocities against another right now. Anyone bothered about KSA attending the FIG conference? Thought not.

Also it’s not really comparable to a boycott. That’s a decision a country makes to exclude itself, not demand that others be excluded.

Whilst the RGF is state funded, it’s employees and officials are not government officials.

There are many things that economically powerful, western governments and organisations could do to actually make a difference to people under attack from authoritarian regimes. This isn’t it, it’s actually detrimental. Every single time you do it, there’s someone in Russia saying you know, Putin is right about the west