Winter Cup Men’s Discussion

[rlayt]

I just can’t listen to another rant. I will get information here from cooler heads.

 

[QuietColours]

The way I understood it: Doing both the Olympics and Worlds meant that he had to stay in peak form from July through October–basically, he had to be there from the beginning of Olympic selection in early July and maintain it until the end of October.

He then had four months from the end of Worlds to Winter Cup, where he absolutely had to qualify for National Team to keep getting a paycheck and be able to afford continuing to do gymnastics. His living costs, health insurance, and training costs depend on it. Most people would have been working upgrades in the periods between Olympics and probably November or so, when they started really working routines for Winter Cup. He didn’t have that time–he needs upgrades, especially on bars, but he didn’t really have time to work on them and get them routine consistent or get out of routine shape and back again in the time he had. Add on to this he’d already been pushing at peak form for over three months and was absolutely exhausted.

There simply wasn’t the time for him to take any real break the way most athletes would after the Olympics and Worlds for basic recovery, much less work upgrades and get them consistent. If having competed at Worlds and Olympics assured him of a NT spot until the summer, he could have used his time better, rested, gotten upgrades in shape, and probably showed up at Winter Cup with a couple of routines so they could verify he was still actively training and deserved his stipend. Instead, he had to be all-around ready and there simply wasn’t time to rest and/or upgrade–he just had to keep grinding.

 

[choclatechip45]

But he has been attending smaller competitions which don’t seem tied to getting a stipend. That is the confusing part. There is a difference between going into the gym and staying in competition shape vs going out and competing in the WOGA Classic and the Houston National Invitation.

 

[MAGfan]

That is what I was thinking too.

Here’s the deal. He is an adult. He can make the choices. I think what he said was more discussion of how hard he has been working to do this. This is his job, and he may be proud of how hard he is working. No one made him keep working without taking time off.

 

[MensGym]

I didn’t see what he did at those 2 smaller meets but he could have practiced some of the harder skills at those meets to see if they are competition ready. It’s a great way to get judge’s feedback.

 

[OnoNoKomachi]

In previous quads, Olympic/WT members were on the NT until summer.

From the athletes point of view, if he had a choice between the way it is now and being guaranteed a spot until summer, most would choose the latter.

However, some of the same people who are now complaining about the current system previously complained about the “lack of accountability” in the US men’s program while at the same time lauding the women’s program working gymnasts into the ground.

The irony.

 

[choclatechip45]

My issue with that is why should someone like Sam who is retired collect a paycheck until the summer?

I feel like you can find a happy medium between promoting growth and making sure guys aren’t burned out.

 

[MensGym]

San is officially finished as of Winter Cup. He’s no longer on the payroll.

 

[choclatechip45]

Yes but under the old system of funding, he would be on the payroll until the summer. Horton was getting funding for 3 years and never competed in those 3 years.

 

[MensGym]

Yes. And like @OnoNoKomachi said, now there’s accountability for that. I think the petition thing was abused. Too many guys were either on the team and never competed or trained there without being able to get on the NT.

 

[choclatechip45]

Yes, but my point is there can be a happy medium by making sure gymnasts aren’t being burned out and people aren’t abusing the system. Maybe have guys send in videos every 6 months?

 

[MensGym]

Yes, I agree with your point.
This is partly why they do NT meets every 6 months. If you petition in February, you should try to compete in august or Vice versa. I feel like if you can’t prove yourself, not including injuries/surgeries, there are others who could possibly take that place.
I knew an athlete that would not compete all year and petition his way to JO nationals to qualify to USA nationals. He did this for many years. How is this fair to the athletes who compete all year long?

 

[choclatechip45]

Exactly it’s not fair. We will see if what they implements works because whatever they did last quad didn’t work.

 

[JDB]

I think the belief is that there has to be a women’s meet for it to get on TV. So, really, it had to move, because in Vegas (Blackjack) it was a MAG meet.

This meet isn’t not a good fit for NBC. It would be better off in Vegas on FlipNow.

 

[MAGfan]

I agree 100%! It was always so much fun at Blackjack. The past 2 years (and i realize last year was due to covid) have been very anemic in attendance. BJ was always standing room only!

 

[OnoNoKomachi]

Yes but under the old system of funding, he would be on the payroll until the summer. Horton was getting funding for 3 years and never competed in those 3 years.

That was the classic case.

 

[Denn]

I didn’t know some of this stuff. Thanks for sharing.