Post qualifications WAG musings

[kimbee]

I have been wondering why Skinner has such rabid fans. Who roots that aggressively for someone like her, with her history or racist and full-of-herself social media posts?

I have only now realized: they are just like her. It’s sad that there seem to be so many of them.

It is disgusting that they are going after Jade.

 

[Jack]

Wow.

“Forster answered a few more questions, then stormed off, saying, ‘I’m going to go. I’m done.’ But there wasn’t much more he could say. He knows that in the end, the tenths of a point that will matter will probably not be the ones gained from substituting one lower-ranked gymnast for another. It will be the tenths of a point that come from star gymnasts performing to their ability. The U.S. will probably still do that. It will just be closer than they expected.”

 

[Sanzhirovka]

Funny thing though. Why would Tom have to speak to Perskaia “on the quiet”? Just have Perskaia come to a mock meet and flat out tell everyone what errors they have in constructing their routines.

Unless you meant Marta was asking Perskaia’s opinion off the record so she could be better informed on her team selections? But honestly, that makes no sense. While those things don’t need to be in press releases for the public, it should all be plainly laid out before the coaches and athletes well ahead of any big meet and probably in some kind of ongoing capacity.

Tom doesn’t need to be sneaky. He (USAG) needs to simply say, “Ladies, this is how judges at the Olympics will judge your routines and here is Tatyana Perskaia who can tell you and your coaches how to improve from a tactical standpoint.” Yields the floor to Perskaia.

And if Perskaia was not taking any initiative to share this information, then frankly, she was not doing her job as a US Brevet judge. And if she was, but was being rebuffed either by Tom or individual coaches, well … (smirks and laughs internally)

 

[ArnoldRimmer]

Yes, I mean asking her off the record in order to be better informed.

I understand the argument about it making no sense, which in some ways it doesn’t, but the problem with doing as you suggest here is that it’s basically saying US domestic scoring isn’t up to the job. There are obvious political considerations in taking a course of action that essentially spells it out.

 

[arabiandoublefront]

Because people like a comeback/redemption story and also implicit bias.

 

[Sanzhirovka]

Any political problems would seem to be within USAG. If US domestic scoring doesn’t make sense, that’s not really Tom’s fault. That is to say, it’s a problem for him, but its not his sole responsibility.

Unless the “women’s high-performance team coordinator” is also responsible for the judges.

And if USAG cannot get its own judges and high performance team on the same track, they deserve to lose.

So, who is above Tom who apparently is not doing their job?

 

[arabiandoublefront]

Tom has such a bad attitude with the media.

 

[RedBirdie]

Tom wants it both ways: to be seen as the embodiment of a USAG that learned from its mistakes, and never ever have someone question him (just as no one ever questioned Marta).

 

[Alinxz23]

I could think of a few reasons and I wouldn’t be surprised if her fan base is made up of supporters of a certain political figure.

 

[irichluck21]

I have a feeling post Olympics the athletes are going to come out against Forster.
They have already voiced concerns. Skinner is DONE so we know she will speak her mind. Biles has no issue speaking out.
All the athletes heading to NCAA.

 

[ArnoldRimmer]

Sure, this isn’t all Tom’s doing by any means. USAG internal competitions had an issue with realistic scoring long before he took the job, and that’s only one of the inherited problems he faces.

However, that still doesn’t mean he’s in a position where it’s realistic for him to be able to say, even just to athletes and coaches, that the scores they get at US Nationals and Trials are so unreliable that another metric needs to be introduced. It would also clearly not stay quiet for long if he did. If I were a US athlete or the coach of one who’d scored very well at Trials but missed out to someone Perskaia thought would do better internationally, I’d have that on twitter approximately 47 seconds after the team announcement and let the stans do their work.

 

[KristyJ]

Oh, they absolutely should know at this point what connections are good/bad, and how the rules and judging work. But at this point we are pretty well aware that there are a bevy of coaches in the US that are less informed than they ought to be, and the national coordination should help address this issue. I am frequently astonished at the lack of understanding some people have about very simple judging issues.

 

[Doug1233]

Literally. It’s not insider secret knowledge that Skinner wasn’t going to get an 8.2E on beam.

The Gymnaverse judging spreadsheet was LITERALLY more accurate than the USAG Trials scores that Tom had in the selection room. We are (largely) a group of amateur gymnastics fans and WE were far closer to the Olympic judging pen than USAG’s own judges.

 

[KristyJ]

I never added my scores to the spreadsheet, but I did judge both Carey’s and Skinner’s in response to the discussion we had going. Forgot to mention there that I had Skinner at a 6.8-7.0 and Carey at an 8.0 on what I think was day two. And they were, what, five or fewer tenths apart in national judging?

 

[rlayt]

I’d like to see something where countries exchange judges for at least one domestic event. In addition to sending athletes to international competitions. There’s probably a reason they don’t and I just don’t know it.

 

[Doug1233]

Less! I think one judge had them equal or 0.1 apart?!

In the end, the Olympic judges were harder on Jade and Skinner than even WE were. And there was some critique that WE were being too harsh.

My lineups for TF would be:

Grace, Jordan, Simone
Jordan, Simone, Suni
Grace, Suni, Simone
Grace, Suni, Simone

Tell Suni to ditch the Double L. Tell Grace to do a STRADDLE as a back up dance element and not a seventh split leap.

 

[Sanzhirovka]

Well, that would never work for an actual domestic meet that coutned for anything, as the risk of sabotage would be too great. But plenty of European countries do in fact invite really qualified FIG judges to their meets. For example, the Belgian FIT meet invited some of the very best FIG judges for its event in July.

 

[irichluck21]

I also think that this is a problem that goes well beyond USAG and into FIG territory. There is no consistency with judging at all.
It shouldn’t be, oh let’s see how the judges score beam. Will it be Montreal scoring or Stuttgart scoring?
The judging should make sense and it often times does not. There is no differentiation.
They went lenient in the first two subdivisions and then were harsher in subdivision 3 and 4. It shouldn’t be like this.
Also, determining beam scores are taking forever. It’s ridiculous that it is the 5th year of the code and the D scores are snails pace.

 

[Doug1233]

Add them! You still can.

Its good for the historical record.

 

[Jack]

What I don’t understand about this whole “SKiNnEr WuZ rObBed” narrative is that her scores only contribute to the team because of Jordan’s meltdown. If you put her on the 4 person team, either her or Jordan has to do UB/BB in TF… which no.