2022 Winter Cup Women's Discussion February 26, 2022

[irichluck21]

DTB Cup Team
Locked:
Konnor McClain
Skye Blakely
eMjae Frazier

I would include:
Ashlee Sullivan 4th AA, 4th on vault, 3rdT BB
Nola Matthews 1st UB, 5thT AA
or
Katelyn Jong 5thT AA

 

[irichluck21]

so they didn’t give frazier Layout credit

harsh IMO but within the guidelines

Frazier’s got a lot of “what ifs” in her beam composition. I don’t see the side leap half getting credit internationally with the technique she is using.

 

[Doug1233]

I don’t see the side leap half getting credit internationally with the technique she is using.

I think it’s fine. The cross split she shows is crossways. She does the turn first then the split.

 

[onodian]

She does the turn first then the split.

And so artistry was for ever saved

 

[KristyJ]

Frazier has surprisingly good leaps, honestly. I’ve thought that many times that I’ve seen her compete. If she could clean up certain other skills to match she’d become a gymnast who’s really worthy of being in the international medal conversation.

 

[Doug1233]

Sullivan on floor they downgraded both the L Hop 1/1 and the Double L. Correct in my opinion. But I can only imagine that they wouldn’t have done this for Chiles at Olympic Trials.

Maybe they finally got the memo…

 

[Doug1233]

For Blakely on floor, I get 5.5 with crediting the Switch Ring and the Split Full (with Switch Full attempt downgraded to C as it wasn’t even close). She got a 5.4. So they either didn’t give the Switch Ring or the Split Full. The Double Wolf was not controversial.

The Split Full could be called a touch short if you say she pre-twisted it. The camera angle is impossible to see if her back foot reached head on the Switch Ring. But I do recall that her Switch Ring isn’t the best. So maybe they nixxed that?

Look at 6:20 in the video above - what do you guys think?

 

[Doug1233]

For Alipio floor, USAG gave 5.0. I gave a 4.9 with a downgrade to the double L, but crediting the Switch Ring and Memmel.

Looks like they credited the Double L and Memmel, but downgraded the Switch Ring.

I would say that the whole first turn on her Double L (10:17) was under horizontal. Similar to Suni’s in Tokyo (which actually never got credit). And her Switch Ring - in real time I absolutely downgraded it, but looking at the slomo, her back foot is at shoulder height but because her head release is so good, its also at head height.

I don’t know how FIG will be evaluating “head height” with respect to Switch Rings with excellent head release. Have any Brevets on here seen any explicit advice other than just “head height”?

If “head” means “forehead”, then I don’t think this gets credit. If “head” means “back of head/ponytail/bun”, then it should get credit.

 

[ruby]

The back foot needs to reach the “crown” of the head, so basically the top part of the head. The still is ok. However the arch is rather poor although her head release is good. Her shoulders are above her hips which is a reason to downgrade.

 

[Doug1233]

I knew it was “crown” but to me that’s the back. The crown of your head isn’t your forehead - it’s the back, no?!

I can’t tell from your post whether you’d downgrade or not? lol

If you would d/g, what basis would you give? I didn’t think “shoulders being in front of hips” was a test for downgrading it.

In real-time I thought i’d definitely downgrade. If the test is the forehead, I would downgrade. But, to me, “crown” doesn’t mean the forehead.

 

[ruby]

I’ve only now watched it and I would downgrade. The still photo is borderline. The foot is at the crown (which is the top part of the head in upright position) but barely but the arch is definitely not good.
In realtime you can see how she just throws her head back but does not bend her upper body back at all.
One of the criteria for a good arch was the head going over the back thigh with the shoulders going behind the hips. If that does not happen, it is a reason to downgrade and the above leap is a really good example for it IMO.

 

[Doug1233]

One of the criteria for a good arch was the head going over the back thigh with the shoulders going behind the hips. If that does not happen, it is a reason to downgrade

Not having “good arch” is not a reason to downgrade, as j read it?

“NO arch” is a reason to downgrade.

“Insufficient arch” is an E Panel deduction.

Are you saying she is displaying “no arch”?

 

[ruby]

I know this…however, it was explained that an arch includes the upper back going back over the leg. If the shoulders go back just a little you’d have insufficient arch. If the shoulders don’t move past the hips you have NO arch. I don’t remember whether this is in one of the 50.000 slides or if it was explained and I don’t want to go look for it now.

 

[FrolovasDoubleLayout]

Agreed - though the foot does meet the crown position and there is head release, the upper back arch is really not there. As you point out, the head is over the hip - more over the hamstring is better,

 

[Doug1233]

Ok. So for my own education, this is an example of “no arch” which warrants downgrade?

 

[ruby]

Yes!

 

[Doug1233]

Maybe I should have gone with my gut instinct!

 

[RedBirdie]

Ella Kate Parker (CGA) won juniors. Here are here routines

 

[RAFIKI]

26 years of following this sport and gymnastics can still surprise me, never seen anyone vault with their leotard in their mouth before! According to interviews she does it as a reminder to keep her head in.

 

[cats]

That seems like it shouldn’t be allowed.

Maybe, if you can’t keep your head in without biting your leo and are 13, you don’t need to be doing a DTY in competition yet.