Romania Gymnastics thread

[MaryClare]

As an athlete rep, for sure, yes. We’re kind of discussing her as a Romanian here, no? Granted i don’t really know what an athlete rep does

But she isn’t part of the Romanian delegation. She was only there because she is the athletes rep and it was in that capacity that Donatella removed her.

 

[RedBirdie]

And let’s be clear, Ponor is the FIG athlete rep. It’s not like she’s the Romanian federation athlete rep, there to support those specific athletes. Either way, she shouldn’t be trying to coach them, but it’s more egregious, imo, because she’s not there with the Romanian fed

 

[MaryClare]

And let’s be clear, Ponor is the FIG athlete rep. It’s not like she’s the Romanian federation athlete rep, there to support those specific athletes. Either way, she shouldn’t be trying to coach them, but it’s more egregious, imo, because she’s not there with the Romanian fed

Yep, as I said, completely unprofessional. Even if her input had been welcomed by the team, it would still be inappropriate

Basically this whole situation encapsulates what is going on in Romania as a whole country at the moment

 

[Gabriel]

Yep, as I said, completely unprofessional. Even if her input had been welcomed by the team, it would still be inappropriate

Basically this whole situation encapsulates what is going on in Romania as a whole country at the moment

Do you mind sharing any insights regarding how this reflects what is happening in Romania? Is it a sports thing or something else entirely?

 

[MaryClare]

Do you mind sharing any insights regarding how this reflects what is happening in Romania? Is it a sports thing or something else entirely?

If you want to discuss in more detail you can message me privately, but to give a brief explanation of what I meant is that Romania is in a period of adjustment as the generation raised in an EU democracy become adults. This is often somewhat at odds with the generation before who enjoy and have benefited from the relative lawlessness of the era immediately post 1989. Romania has also experienced migration from other parts of the EU, especially in recent years as it’s considered an attractive destination for “digital nomads”

 

[Caledi]

I don’t know how press accreditation works but surely the FIG could refuse to give a press pass to Alina Alexoi, in the future, right? I think cussing at an athlete is a good enough reason to not allow her in the press zone at future events.

 

[brg09]

What the actual f? I understand how this came to be and how the lines were drawn, but it’s disappointing to see Silivas in particular acting like this.

I never had very high regard for Ponor or Voinea so I would expect it from them but Silivas always seemed like a decent and low-drama person.

Hopefully cooler heads prevail and people realize these changes need to happen.

 

[makam]

What the actual f? I understand how this came to be and how the lines were drawn, but it’s disappointing to see Silivas in particular acting like this.

I never had very high regard for Ponor or Voinea so I would expect it from them but Silivas always seemed like a decent and low-drama person.

Hopefully cooler heads prevail and people realize these changes need to happen.

Yeah, the path they were on was a dead end. God knows Larissa probably would have loved to have a few other gymnasts to help carry the load. They don’t seem to have any prodigies but a core of solid gymnasts who stay healthy (and actually like the sport) can be the start of a new era.

 

[Denn]

Based on what we’re seeing here… There’s more to the story for sure.

I don’t think that Ponor saying a little something from the sidelines is a huge deal, and it probably was more like Donatella S just kind of said “Hey, do me a favor. Patrick’s whining about this. Can you back off a little for me?”

 

[MaryClare]

Hey, do me a favor. Patrick’s whining about this. Can you back off a little for me?

That is absolutely not what is being described. For Donatella to have the athletes rep removed from podium training, it would have to be extremely serious

 

[Puffin]

Front what the article is saying Ponor appeared to be telling the athletes to change their routines and deliberately undermining/overruling Romania’s national coach. This would seem an extraordinary action from an FIG rep. If it was just the coach moaning then Ponor could have been moved to a different section of PT and not removed from the arena - so FIG seem to have taken it seriously at least.

The turmoil in in the Romanian Federation seems to continue between the old guard who resent a “foreigner” coming in to coach. We have seen it in the public spats between coaches - but now it seems to be tipping over into derision against the gymnasts where only Sabrina is the golden child and the others, trained by Kiens are heavily criticised by the old guard and the media. It seems to have gone way too far on the parts of some adults who should know better: Ponor attempting to overrule the coach, the old guard’s friendly journalist screaming at Barbosu, and Silivas disparaging the team for basically “only going to the Olympics to make up the numbers” (although not a feat the old guard managed since 2012) - while all of these people appear friends with Camelia Voinea.

A lot of the division in the team seems to centre around Sabrina and her mother. The separate training locations, the promotion of Sabrina as the “only true star”, the refusal of Mama Voinea to assist anyone on the team but her daughter (noticeable in qualifying where she would only touch a springboard if Sabrina were to use it). I suspect there was great disgruntlement among Voinea and her allies that Sabrina was benched on ub and therefore kept out of AA (a reasonable decision) yet the irony is that Rom WAG would have probably made TF without Sabrina’s zero on vt in quals.

I don’t know whether these individuals will pull together but the fragmentation into factions is not helping Rom to come back

 

[brg09]

That’s too bad, really. Because the team is looking very good with Kiens’ coaching. They are improving for sure.

I can only hope that someone in/around the federation is willing to take the unpopular opinion that the foreign coaching needs to keep happening and major changes to the way things are done in Romania needs to occur. To be fair other federations have been dealing with the same issue (change of attitude) for almost a decade now, and still haven’t figured it out. So it won’t be easy.

 

[irichluck21]

The fact that bars alone are ACTUALLY watchable for the Romanians speaks volumes of Kiens’ coaching ability.

They are just mad that a foreigner came in.

 

[MaryClare]

They are just mad that a foreigner came in.

Yep, as I said earlier it very much mirrors exactly what is happening in Romania as a whole. For the first time, the country is experiencing skilled inward migration from developed countries and suddenly corruption, back hand deals and blood feuds are no longer acceptable. Particularly relevant to the situation in Romanian gymnastics is how the country is adapting to the generation of young adults now coming of age who have been brought up in an EU democracy and do not see themselves different to young people in Germany, France, Holland etc.

 

[brg09]

Yep, as I said earlier it very much mirrors exactly what is happening in Romania as a whole. For the first time, the country is experiencing skilled inward migration from developed countries and suddenly corruption, back hand deals and blood feuds are no longer acceptable. Particularly relevant to the situation in Romanian gymnastics is how the country is adapting to the generation of young adults now coming of age who have been brought up in an EU democracy and do not see themselves different to young people in Germany, France, Holland etc.

That is interesting. From an academic standpoint, I was in college from 2005-2009 and saw the integration of Romania and Bulgaria into the EU in 2007 (?) And a bunch of other central/east european countries before that. And there has always been this massive gulf between east and west in europe… so it’s intriguing to see this start to gradually melt away, and affect these countries in ways we didn’t even fathom 15 years ago. It’s fascinating, really.

And I suppose it must be felt particularly keenly in gymnastics–an area that Romania excelled in for so many years. Taking advice from a foreign coach must be humiliating to some of these former athletes and coaches. I mean, I’m sure some of these retired athletes would have no issue with consultant environmentalists or experts in governance coming in and suggesting tweaks. But gymnastics?! NO WAY!

 

[MaryClare]

But gymnastics?! NO WAY

Oh I can absolutely relate. I am the most foreign person my sports school has ever employed. Even though I am a Russian national, Russian speaker and came with letters of recommendation from 2 London based ex USSR coach and athlete. I’m not in any important position, I just teach the dance aspects of gymnastics and even then it has been an issue for some!

 

[CameliasFingerpaint]

The fact that bars alone are ACTUALLY watchable for the Romanians speaks volumes of Kiens’ coaching ability.

They are just mad that a foreigner came in.

The fact that it took only 10 months for the Romanians to get their bars to a watchable and consistent place is honestly infuriating.

 

[Denn]

That is absolutely not what is being described. For Donatella to have the athletes rep removed from podium training, it would have to be extremely serious

Fair enough.

 

[Matilda23]

I watched The Secret of Deva documentary about Raluca Haidu and the some of coaches seemed like awful people.

Did The Golden Girl Raducan documentary show Gogean coaching the juniors?

 

[brg09]

I watched The Secret of Deva documentary about Raluca Haidu and the some of coaches seemed like awful people.

Did The Golden Girl Raducan documentary show Gogean coaching the juniors?

I love that documentary. Classic!