Ask an Expert Judge, (aka the misc. technical questions thread)

[irichluck21]

Yeah, I mean Simone and Laurant are banking on it only being the stated ND for vault having him up there. Know the rules to feel comfortable about breaking them and all that.

But also for stuff like this:
missing bib, which was an accident (but all head coaches should make sure of all gymnasts have their number on)
matching leotards (Jamaica lost out on Pan Am Team Finals last year due to a ND, their entire team wore different NT leotards, the deduction cost them a historical placement.
Missing the national flag (I forget which country it was that was missing the flag)

Like these things should all be common sense and known by coaches, especially the ones selected as head coach for the delegation.

The YDP spot, is a bit different. They know the deduction is in the code for having the spotter and are willing to take it.

Hopefully that doesn’t back fire at Worlds!

 

[Kittentoes]

Chusovitina used to do that.

 

[onodian]

She did punch front- back tuck, are you sure you’re not remembering that?

 

[navyblue]

We’ve all heard about downgrades… but who knew you could actually get a skill upgraded unintentionally.

 

[RichardL]

I wonder how much that “tuck becomes stretch” illustration would be deducted if the judges called it a layout, lol. What an unpleasant body position to contemplate.

 

[navyblue]

All I can imagine from this illustration is someone’s Yurchenko Double Tuck getting upgraded to a Double Layout shortly before breaking their neck.

Maybe this is more a real thing in trampoline/acro than artistic.

 

[RichardL]

 

[Hatsumomo]

Man, under today’s rules those vaults would have been 0s for hands hitting the mat first. The second vault definitely, the first there’s a little room for giving Slater the benefit of the doubt.

But on the topic of an open tuck position getting credited as a layout and it’s also from the Sydney Olympics, the Spanish(?) gymnast doing a front layout vault that was in the sheep jump position.

 

[Concorde]

But on the topic of an open tuck position getting credited as a layout and it’s also from the Sydney Olympics, the Spanish(?) gymnast doing a front layout vault that was in the sheep jump position.

You’re thinking of Daniele Hypolito.

 

[Hatsumomo]

That’s who it is, thank you!

 

[irichluck21]

But on the topic of an open tuck position getting credited as a layout and it’s also from the Sydney Olympics, the Spanish(?) gymnast doing a front layout vault that was in the sheep jump position.

Produnova used to do her Phelps in a sheep jump position pretty much.

 

[MaryClare]

One of gymnastics great mysteries is why, other than that one day at the 1999 universaide, was Produnova so bad at vaulting.

 

[lovegymnasts]

The memories. I detested that Russian leo so much.

 

[RedBirdie]

That’s, like, the only true Phelps I have ever seen. She completed the half twist early enough to do a true layout(ish) front Salto.

 

[irichluck21]

That’s, like, the only true Phelps I have ever seen. She completed the half twist early enough to do a true layout(ish) front Salto.

Kathy Johnson also commented on this and said it was a true Phelps despite it looking “funny”.

 

[Aeris]

The timing of Produnova’s turn there is so awkward, her body really wanted to do a 1/4-on Kas entry. She only does a 1/4-on to the table as it is, then keeps twisting into the backwards position for the briefest moment, and then immediately pushes off the table into a sideways position and completes the first salto while sideways in the air.

This is a good example of why people on the modern vault table have simplified most of the Tsuk vaults into Kas vaults, just doing a 1/4-on entry. For the real Phelps vault, there was a 1/2-on to the table and rise off the table fully backwards, before doing another 1/2 turn in the air.

 

[navyblue]

Yeah the whole “Phelps” vault concept confused me as a kid, and it never made any more sense over time. Phelps didn’t even do her eponymous vault the way that it was conceived of – Produnova is definitely closer – and it’s exhibit A in a long list of reasons why I think ‘turn timing’ is a pretty lousy way to define/distinguish skills on any event.

 

[Kittentoes]

And turn direction. I always get confused there anyway.

 

[tempest]

Did Miller do the Phelps better? If Miller had hit VT in EF in 94, She probably would have been VT champ!

 

[navyblue]

Yeah, even as someone who regretfully learned twisting Tsukahara vaults at the expense of a more efficient Kasamatsu style, I still don’t think Tsuks ought to be be rewarded more. It’s like… yeah, sure, they’re harder, but so what? What is the artistic value gained from doing the harder skill when even mega gym fans can’t differentiate it?