Shilese Jones vs. Rebeca Andrade

[lovegymnasts]

I loved it especially the mount

 

[Denn]

I don’t think she would have done the harder vault. It would have been her Olympic vaults.

There used to be video of the Kas-full she did (what you called a DTT) but it wasn’t great. I can’t find the video on YouTube anymore though.

 

[onodian]

I mean that routine as a whole is fantastic, you raised her well. I was just talking about the choreo and how it blends (or doesn’t) into the routine as a whole.

 

[L_R]

As much as I love Shilese aren’t we forgetting Melanie ?

 

[Concorde]

There used to be video of the Kas-full she did (what you called a DTT) but it wasn’t great. I can’t find the video on YouTube anymore though.

 

[Yarotska]

As much as I love Shilese aren’t we forgetting Melanie ?

No, she just doesn’t have the track record nor did she look as capable of 57+ as Shilese recently.

 

[navyblue]

1. Biles
2. Andrade
3. Jones
4. Listunova
5. De Jesus dos Santos
6. Melnikova
7. D’Amato
8. Yushan
9. Gadirova…

Who do we think are the top 10 AA field at the moment?

 

[RichardL]

Gadirova’s Cheng certainly shoots her up to the top 5 in my mind. But I like this list.

 

[irichluck21]

Who do we think are the top 10 AA field at the moment?

I would put Blakely in the top 10. Leanne Wong too.

 

[esta]

I think Black, Visser, and Kovacs have the scoring potential to be in top 10 as well. Maybe Godwin and Thorsdottir on a good day, too.

 

[RichardL]

I think this was more about a theoretical top 10 if everyone hits. There can only be 10 lol. There have now been 16 names put out. Who would you cut from the original list to make room for Black, Visser, and Kovacs? To me they are definitely not better AAers than anyone in the original list.

 

[blake]

I disagree about Kovacs. Ou hasn’t competed a DTY since Tokyo iirc, and without it, I think Kovacs is on par with her. With a DTY, I agree she’s got a higher potential. I don’t believe D’Amato is stronger than Kovacs. Kovacs has the superior DTY, made BB finals last year at worlds, is equally as capable of putting up a mid 14 on bars, and isn’t far behind D’Amato in terms of floor potential. In real life, Kovacs beat D’Amato both days at Euros this year including the AA where she whacked her feet on the bar.

I agree with you on Black/Visser not being close to the original list + Kovacs. Black, however, has a knack for outperforming superior all-arounders in AA finals.

I agree with Rich about Blakely. If you substitute her 2022 floor for her rough performances at nationals this year, she’s stronger than D’Amato/Ou, and on par with Gadirova/MDJDS.

I’d like to pour one out for Giorgia Villa who absolutely could have been on this list if Enrico Casella hadn’t driven her into the ground. She had so much potential, and apparently she exacerbated a back problem at their nationals. Such a shame.

 

[Beamer]

Annia’s DTT VT had good height and distance, and thus it scored pretty well. The problem with it was that she twisted it into the ground, which was dangerous and prone to tearing her ACL, which of course happened.

I disagree, however, that she would have competed a tsuk 1.5 in EF at 2003 Worlds had she not torn her ACL on the DTT just prior to Qualification. For one, she was practicing the DTT, and that’s how she tore her ACL.

Secondly, I don’t think there’s any record of Annia competing a tsuk 1.5 prior to her ACL tear, but I could be wrong.

She did the tsuk double in 2002 at U.S. Classic and I’m pretty sure at Nationals. And I think again at Nationals in 2003. Correct me if I’m wrong.

It just doesn’t make sense to be vaulting a tsuk double for a year as her second vault and then scale it back to a 1.5 when it matters most. Plus, she and Alan showed no signs of backing off a vault that could tear her ACL, and it in fact happened just days before EF while practicing the double.

I think the tsuk 1.5 was a post-ACL tear thing that happened because she now had less than a year to get back, and vaulting a shady tsuk double on a not yet fully healed knee in 2004 was clearly a bad idea.

 

[Beamer]

Regarding Listunova and Melnikova being in the top ten AAers, will the Russian athletes have a chance to compete as individuals at Worlds this year?

If not, based on her performance last year, Kinsella has a good shot of finishing top ten even if she wouldn’t were everyone to hit their max.

Saraiva also looked killer in the AA last year and top ten material until she got injured. I hope we’ll see her at full strength this year, but she didn’t compete at BRA Nationals this year, did she?

 

[Passion]

will the Russian athletes have a chance to compete as individuals at Worlds this year?

There will be no Russians at 2023 Worlds.

 

[MaryClare]

Regarding Listunova and Melnikova being in the top ten AAers, will the Russian athletes have a chance to compete as individuals at Worlds this year?

No. The FIG ban on Russian and Belarusian athletes ends 1st Jan 2024. They will be able to compete as neutral individuals in FIG events and potentially qualify to the Olympics via the World Cup events. However, their participation in down to the IOC and what decision it makes regarding the reinstatement of Russian and Belarusian athletes (whilst Belarus is not significant to WAG and MAG, it is to Trampoline and RG)

 

[navyblue]

Came up with this table of rankings with 90 minutes of procrastiation! Best scores from the quad. It’s sorta like what they do on thegymtern.net, but not the exact same methodology…

I went looking for the top 10 in the world, but got to 16 with the following caveats:

• Respecting/not respecting 2 per country rules (bold names could make an AA final)
• Ignored Russian ban because who knows…
• Russian scores obviously have the biggest domestic asterisk (to the point that some of the scores that snuck in here are supposedly using a modified code per @MaryClare ), which I think could likely knock down Listunova a placement, and Melnikova 2-3 pegs. Urazova’s inclusion at al is questionable…
• On the flip side, I extended this top 11 after two per country intentionally include Ou Yushan who I think benefits least from domestic scoring since China keeps scoring tight even at home.
• It’s interesting to see the gymnasts whose potential and actual best have huge discrepancies. Urazova and Kovacs obviously have some large consistency issues, and with Roberson I think it’s not so much consistency as the huge outlier of that 13.0 bar routine instead of her more typical high-11s.

 

[MaryClare]

To my knowledge, neither Russian championships nor Russia cup used a modified code, only the spartakaida (which is not organised by RGF)

 

[CameliasFingerpaint]

Is there a timeline for the IOC decision? It seems like it’s getting pretty down to the wire.

 

[MaryClare]

I don’t think there is. They have definitely been dragging their heels and they’ve left it up to the individual governing bodies of the sports to make a decision. In most sports, Russian and Belarusian athletes will have qualification opportunities, so this takes the pressure off the IOC until spring 2024 really