Event (FIG) Scoring Worlds Routines

[Aeris]

They both separate their legs in the salto — Melnikova's is much earlier, and Schoenmaier only does it at the end. But I feel like you take 0.1 no matter what for that.

Karina shouldn't be deducted for leg separation on that vault. Her legs are totally together until immediately before landing, where they separate a tiny amount that isn't visible in real time.

Melnikova has both crossed legs and leg separation, bent knee, more piking, lower chest landing. It won't be a bigger deduction on the pike, but that landing position is deductible.

Karina has the .3 step instead of Melnikova's .1, but from entry through landing her form is better by .4, that's .2 advantage to her. Melnikova also could be deducted for two .1 steps on landing, she's leaning back slightly after the first hop and doesn't hold the landing, her step into the salute could be a viewed as a needed step for balance.

 

[Doug1233]

Screen caps can be a great tool for teaching at times, but it's not really fair to pull them out to justify one score against another when the judges aren't using them.

I used the screenshots because it demonstrates what we should all be seeing in real-time.

Maybe I am being outvoted here. The overall quality of Schoenmaier's vault is vastly superior, IMO. The judges shouldn't need screenshots to see it.

First Flight Phase
Melnikova - 0.1 - leg separation
Schoenmaier - 0.0
Support Phase
Melnikova - 0.2 (turn began too early, bent arms)
Schoenmaier - 0.1 (turn began too early)
Second Flight Phase
Melnikova - 0.4 (leg crossed, leg separation, body alignment in stretch, failure to maintain stretch)
Schoenmaier - 0.3 (legs crossed, body alignment in stretch, height, distance)
Landing
Melnikova - 0.2 (hop x 2)
Schoenmaier - 0.1 (hop)

Total
Melnikova - 9.1
Schoenmaier - 9.5

It was a superior vault, all around, for me. My issue isn't with Melnikova's score (although the leg separation coming into landing is borderline 0.3) it is how low Shoenmaier's is.

 

[Doug1233]

Karina shouldn't be deducted for leg separation on that vault. Her legs are totally together until immediately before landing, where they separate a tiny amount that isn't visible in real time.

Melnikova has both crossed legs and leg separation, bent knee, more piking, lower chest landing. It won't be a bigger deduction on the pike, but that landing position is deductible.

Karina has the .3 step instead of Melnikova's .1, but from entry through landing her form is better by .4, that's .2 advantage to her. Melnikova also could be deducted for two .1 steps on landing, she's leaning back slightly after the first hop and doesn't hold the landing, her step into the salute could be a viewed as a needed step for balance.

Totally agree. Except that I don't even think Shoenmaier should get 0.3 for the landing.

 

[KristyJ]

I have Schoenmaier around a 9.2, Melnikova at 9.0, and Jocelyn's is about right at 8.6. I would take 0.3 for Schoenmaier's landing, but the fact that she has more height than Melnikova keeps her ahead.

If I recall correctly, that's about what I had them at on the day of, as well.

 

[Aeris]

It should be 0.2 landing, but no such thing exists since the code sucks. Interesting we're all thinking a bit different about the amplitude. I'd say they are about even (.1 off for each of them).

 

[Doug1233]

I have Schoenmaier around a 9.2, Melnikova at 9.0, and Jocelyn's is about right at 8.6. I would take 0.3 for Schoenmaier's landing, but the fact that she has more height than Melnikova keeps her ahead.

What are your 0.5 other tenths for Schoenmaier?

 

[Doug1233]

Either way, given how bunched the E Scores are on vault, I think we can all agree that Melnikova's should not have been ranked higher in execution.

 

[KristyJ]

What are your 0.5 other tenths for Schoenmaier?

Angle at repulsion (pre-rotate) .1, Hip angle/slight pike .1, leg form near landing .1, soft feet in post flight .1, height .1, I did not take distance for her

 

[ruby]

Schönmeier's vault is better, but she isn't without mistake in any phase while Melnikova's slightly bigger issues don't necessary warrant the bigger deductions. That's why you end up with essentially the same score. If you don't agree with it, you need to not take a deduction for some of Schönmeier's tiny issues or take the .3 for some of Melnikova's that look like more than .1. All to create the difference the Code doesn't really offer.

 

[Doug1233]

Yes it seems like the problems stem from the 1-3-5 model.

Melnikova's mistakes (like the leg sep) are borderline 1-3, so most judges go with 1. Karina's are visible, so they also get 1 - even though Melnikova's are visibly worse. And they end up with the same score. It is a shame.

We need the 0.05 and 2 options back. I think that would fix a lot of the bunching we see.

If you don't agree with it, you need to not take a deduction for some of Schönmeier's tiny issues

I would do this.

 

[eanda]

I used the screenshots because it demonstrates what we should all be seeing in real-time.

Maybe I am being outvoted here. The overall quality of Schoenmaier's vault is vastly superior, IMO. The judges shouldn't need screenshots to see it.

....,

It was a superior vault, all around, for me. My issue isn't with Melnikova's score (although the leg separation coming into landing is borderline 0.3) it is how low Shoenmaier's is.

I get what you're doing with the screenshots, I'm just not a fan of the practice for judging purposes. It would be great if we did see all of this in real time, but different positions and speed of the event, sometimes it's not all seen.

I actually agree that Schoenmaier had the better vault here, but with the deductions available, also see how the results landed where they did. I know when I was judging (much lower level) I was sometimes surprised to have a routine that overall felt "worse" than another come up with a better score.

As far as what can help this, I completely agree on bringing back the .05 and .2 deductions as a great starting point.

It would be interesting to know what the range was of the high and low scores that weren't used on these vaults.

 

[KristyJ]

I feel like in lieu of a great angle from which to view the vaults this competition (seriously what were some of those camera angles?), we're making do with what we can. I would hope the judges could see the appropriate errors decently in real time.

Strong agree on bringing back the full range of half and full tenth deductions.