Mikhail Voronin Cup

[lovegymnasts]

If the point of 2 per and 3 per is representation, they already have it in the prelims. I will say it again, it should be the top 24 regardless of country. The best should be competing. The concept that athletes in the top 15 should not compete so the 40th ranked athlete can is ridiculous. This meet highlights this issue, the bronze medalist placed 7th.

 

[tempest]

I’m aware of the whys behind the decision to move to 2. Still think it’s stupid. And the fact is, moving to 24 and seeding the rotations has not resulted increased TV broadcasts. FIG has made change after change after change to chase broadcaster money, and it hasn’t resulted in squat.

It didn’t make sense in 2001/2003 and with streaming, it makes even less sense in 2022

 

[irichluck21]

It is funny because the American delegation and western Europe fought for 3 per country for decades.
Now they are the ones most effected by it.

I do agree with 5-4-3 that it should go to 3 per country.

In Rio, half the teams used 3 AAers and the other 3 teams did not. BRA, USA, RUS, FRA, JPN, NED all used a 3rd AAer, and out of these 6, 5 teams had to drop a gymnasts as part of 2 per country. But Netherlands had van Gerner in 25th spot

So allowing these 4 wouldn’t have been a big deal as it didn’t eliminate any athletes from non-team countries.
The problem with that would be that ITA would not have representation in the AA final.

These athletes were bumped: Douglas (USA), Sugihara (JPN), Melnikova (RUS), Barbosa (BRA)

Here are the last 4 qualifiers: Vanhille (FRA), Ferlito (ITA), Scheder (GER), and Ferrari (ITA).

Barbosa ended up subbing in for Saravia and ended up not being able to finish the meet after getting injured on floor.
So we were just missing Douglas, Melnikova, and Sugihara in the finals.
If you look at the 4 who got in after 2 per country, the results were not too crazily impacted.
Vanhille was 21st and Scheder 23rd.
The Italians did better with Ferrari moving up to 16th and Ferlito in 12th.
But none of these four were anywhere near medal contention.

Arguably Melnikova and Sugihara would not factor into the medals. So the only case to consider would be Douglas, since she was 3rd in qualifications and easily could have taken a silver or bronze all around medal.

 

[ArnoldRimmer]

The wider context is very different now too, in that we don’t expect the top AAers to also dominate the EFs. Per country limits are very much borne of a time when there genuinely might only have been gymnasts from the top 3 or so teams in event finals. Also, the fact that vault requires two vaults in prelims makes it more diverse because it’s so unusual for a team to have more than one or two vaulters max. There are so few occasions when anyone has been 2 per’d out of a vault final.

So those factors alone mean we’re likely to see a wider range of countries represented in finals than we did when country limits came in, even if those rules were to go.

 

[Yarotska]

I’m aware of the whys behind the decision to move to 2. Still think it’s stupid. And the fact is, moving to 24 and seeding the rotations has not resulted increased TV broadcasts. FIG has made change after change after change to chase broadcaster money, and it hasn’t resulted in squat.

Not to mention a figure skating final is on average FOUR (4) hours and they don’t have TV networks demanding they reduce their competitors. Like, why has figure skating remained largely unchanged but gymnastics has jumped through a million hoops to please people that don’t actually give a shit? They have similar audiences.

 

[Sasha]

Honestly I’d settle for no cap for the top 10. I doubt they’ll ever go back to three per, but seeing a fifth place finisher (for example) eliminated is so brutal.

 

[Doug1233]

Honestly I’d settle for no cap for the top 10

Or at least the top 5. It’s a travesty that Jordyn and Gabby weren’t in the AA finals in London and Rio. They were better than the eventual medalists!

That’s a random piece of trivia - has there ever been an EF “cut off” score from TQ that would have medalled in the actual EF?

I wonder if 2022 EF BB would have?

ETA: Nope! Shilese was the first reserve for beam finals (13.2). That score would have placed 6th in EF.

 

[irichluck21]

3 per and 2 per for AA is outdated because the teams are smaller and less go up on each event, compared to 84, 88, 92 Olympics where all 6 did the AA and in Atlanta you could have 6 AAers like Romania was forced with, and the others could put up 5 AAers.

Tokyo was different due to 4-4-3 but London and Rio with 5 members meant that max 3 AAers went up.

Compared to Atlanta where all 5 US AAers were in the top 36 and all 6 Romanian gymnasts were also in the top 36. The last qualifier to the AA finals was Nikolett Krausz of Hungary who finished 48th.
Meanwhile Australia qualified 3 AAers to finals but none finished in the top 36. They were Skinner (37), Hughes (43), and Moniz (44).

Of the individuals only Chuso (30) qualified outright. Teammate Dzyundzyak was 38, Tousek of Canada was 39, and Rocchi (Italy) was 46.
Russia only used 4 AAers and all 4 qualified with Grosheva in 14th 3 per’d.
Dolgopolova, Lyapina, and Kuznetsova did 3 pieces each, with Dolgopolova off beam, Lyapina off bars and optional vault, and Kuznetsova off FX and compulsory vault.

 

[KorbutFan]

They used the same format at the ‘89 Worlds as well.

 

[irichluck21]

They used the same format at the ‘89 Worlds as well.

Yup I remember finding 89 Worlds AA on YouTube and was wondering why they split the competitors. It was great because the coverage showed so many competitors I had never seen before. Also loved that we got to see the top 12 teams in optionals.

 

[Denn]

I was slightly higher on bars and slightly lower on floor, so I came out basically the same. No way she would have beaten Andrade.

 

[Doug1233]

No way she would have beaten Andrade.

Who’s saying that?! She was no way good enough to win here, even with Andrade’s errors.