Livvy Dunne and the no good very bad take

[MaryClare]

I definitely feel that a lot of the attention surrounding her has waned. It’s a double edged sword. She promotes gymnastics and women’s sports for all the wrong reasons, but she has definitely increased the monetary value of collegiate gymnasts, something that hundreds of her peers have been able to benefit from.

A couple of years ago I was concerned that there would be some sort of race to become the next Livvy Dunne but there doesn’t seem to be anyone waiting in the wings in that respect.

 

[IratePanda]

I definitely feel that a lot of the attention surrounding her has waned. It’s a double edged sword. She promotes gymnastics and women’s sports for all the wrong reasons, but she has definitely increased the monetary value of collegiate gymnasts, something that hundreds of her peers have been able to benefit from.

A couple of years ago I was concerned that there would be some sort of race to become the next Livvy Dunne but there doesn’t seem to be anyone waiting in the wings in that respect.

And thank heavens for that.

This thread comes as such a relief to me, lol. Livvy wrongs me on so many levels--as a mom, as a former college athlete, as an educator, and, hell yes, as a woman. I'm glad I'm not alone.

 

[ArnoldRimmer]

A couple of years ago I was concerned that there would be some sort of race to become the next Livvy Dunne but there doesn’t seem to be anyone waiting in the wings in that respect.

I can kind of see why.

She's made her money, of course, but it's meant missing out on a lot of other things. Maybe there are other, more desirable ways of getting paid not quite as well but having a more enjoyable and normal experience.

 

[IratePanda]

I can kind of see why.

She's made her money, of course, but it's meant missing out on a lot of other things. Maybe there are other, more desirable ways of getting paid not quite as well but having a more enjoyable and normal experience.

Yes, and perhaps an experience that isn't so heavily reliant on hypersexualization. I can't speak for any NCAA gymnasts, but a number of my undergrads are female athletes who shake their heads in dismay at Livvy's marketing tactics. (I live in her home state, so she's very well-known here.)

 

[hmmmm]

If she is so concerned about how the average 'gymnastics' fan that follows her on social media feels about real scores - she can just go heavy with the photoshop on those numbers like she does on her images.

 

[barbara_dewey]

She's an exhibitionist.

 

[BB12]

All the power to Livvy for posting the type of content she does and making bank. I really disagree with her take and think it completely misses the mark on what most in the sport are calling for. We should want legitimate scores instead of fake high scores for entertainment purpose.

I just hope the next 'face of NCAA gymnastics' gets that title due to their performance instead of their personal social media brand. .

 

[OnlyBeansOnToast]

She's going to do a Livvy issue NFT isn't she?

Yesterday I read that the Doomsday Clock is now closer to midnight than it has ever been and I, for one, welcome the looming nuclear armageddon.

 

[ArnoldRimmer]

Yes, and perhaps an experience that isn't so heavily reliant on hypersexualization. I can't speak for any NCAA gymnasts, but a number of my undergrads are female athletes who shake their heads in dismay at Livvy's marketing tactics. (I live in her home state, so she's very well-known here.)

Absolutely. That sort of thing isn't for everyone, especially not over such a sustained period. I couldn't hack managing that fanbase for 4 hours, never mind 4 years.

 

[OnlyBeansOnToast]

Absolutely. That sort of thing isn't for everyone, especially not over such a sustained period. I couldn't hack managing that fanbase for 4 hours, never mind 4 years.

There's a part of me that has a kind of grudging respect for her, monetising the male gaze on her own terms and setting herself up for life by essentially exploiting hormone-addled teenage boys. She's absolutely a symptom of what's wrong with our superficial society rather than a root cause of it. And her antics are of course enabled by media both online and and traditional - be it the the Daily Mail's sidebar of shame, the Sports Illustrated Swimsuit Issue (about which I still do a massive WTF every time I hear about it, because how does that persist in 2025?) or the army of demented gym parents trying to push their own little level three darlings as the next Instagram superstars.

But that's increasingly outweighed by the wider damage she has done (and is doing) to the sport and to other women and girls involved in it, the pressure she is (no doubt inadvertently) putting on other gymnasts to look and behave a certain way and the increased sexualisation of gymnastics just as it was beginning to edge away from that narrative and into one based on athletes' strength and skill rather than their appearance. It's deeply selfish, and I'm not convinced she's too dumb to not recognise that.

The pressure on women and girls to look a certain way is of course near-universal but actively bringing it into sport removes a place where ability should be the primary focus. It makes me kind of sad that the world in which Dunne is the best-known college gymnast on the planet solely because of how she looks is the same world in which Alice Kinsella came close to retiring because of the side effects of medication she was taking to combat acne because of worries about how she looks. Jen and / or Jess has recently started doing regular insta story updates about her visits to mid-Buckinghamshire's number one acne-treatment clinic and it just makes me scream inside knowing that masses of their followers are young girls already worried about how others see their own changing bodies and instead of thinking "I could be fit and healthy like her!" are being encouraged to think "I could be spot-free like her!"

"We have used our gains to gild our shackles, but not break them," as Susan Faludi wrote almost 20 years ago.

Sorry, rant over.

 

[Denn]

Amazing that a gymnast caused the Doomsday Clock to move closer to midnight.

 

[Denn]

@MaryClare I resonate with that thought, and @ArnoldRimmer @IratePanda I really would have thought that there would be at least ONE gymnast trying to replicate what she did. Maybe there has been, but we aren't aware, not being in the target audience and all...

 

[OnlyBeansOnToast]

Amazing that a gymnast caused the Doomsday Clock to move closer to midnight.

The Bulletin Of The Atomic Scientists informs decisions on setting the clock by "monitoring new developments in technology that could inflict irrevocable harm to humanity," which suggests they saw @ArnoldRimmer's prediction of a Livvy NFT and acted accordingly.

 

[MaryClare]

Yesterday I read that the Doomsday Clock is now closer to midnight than it has ever been and I, for one, welcome the looming nuclear armageddon.

If you want to speed that up, I know a man who knows a man

 

[MaryClare]

There's a part of me that has a kind of grudging respect for her, monetising the male gaze on her own terms and setting herself up for life by essentially exploiting hormone-addled teenage boys. She's absolutely a symptom of what's wrong with our superficial society rather than a root cause of it. And her antics are of course enabled by media both online and and traditional - be it the the Daily Mail's sidebar of shame, the Sports Illustrated Swimsuit Issue (about which I still do a massive WTF every time I hear about it, because how does that persist in 2025?) or the army of demented gym parents trying to push their own little level three darlings as the next Instagram superstars.

But that's increasingly outweighed by the wider damage she has done (and is doing) to the sport and to other women and girls involved in it, the pressure she is (no doubt inadvertently) putting on other gymnasts to look and behave a certain way and the increased sexualisation of gymnastics just as it was beginning to edge away from that narrative and into one based on athletes' strength and skill rather than their appearance. It's deeply selfish, and I'm not convinced she's too dumb to not recognise that.

The pressure on women and girls to look a certain way is of course near-universal but actively bringing it into sport removes a place where ability should be the primary focus. It makes me kind of sad that the world in which Dunne is the best-known college gymnast on the planet solely because of how she looks is the same world in which Alice Kinsella came close to retiring because of the side effects of medication she was taking to combat acne because of worries about how she looks. Jen and / or Jess has recently started doing regular insta story updates about her visits to mid-Buckinghamshire's number one acne-treatment clinic and it just makes me scream inside knowing that masses of their followers are young girls already worried about how others see their own changing bodies and instead of thinking "I could be fit and healthy like her!" are being encouraged to think "I could be spot-free like her!"

"We have used our gains to gild our shackles, but not break them," as Susan Faludi wrote almost 20 years ago.

Sorry, rant over.

I don’t think it’s ok to exploit male sexuality, anymore than it’s ok to exploit female sexuality. Especially when it’s teenagers. It’s damaging to them on a personal level, and damaging to wider society. Including the expectations and beauty standards that the young men who consume her content will have on the women they encounter in the real world.

 

[Sasha]

It makes me kind of sad that the world in which Dunne is the best-known college gymnast on the planet solely because of how she looks is the same world in which Alice Kinsella came close to retiring because of the side effects of medication she was taking to combat acne because of worries about how she looks.

Well said. Dunne is no slouch at gymnastics, but I'd love for the next "face of NCAA" to be known primarily for their gymnastics.

 

[JaJa]

what do we think about the ESPN Body Issue which a number of gymnasts posed for? Or SI? Is there a difference between those and what Livvy peddles?

 

[RedBirdie]

The Body Issue was supposed to be about celebrating the diversity of elite athlete bodies, and I feel like they at least used to do an okay job at that. Although I'll admit, I don't recall the last time I remember seeing it mentioned, so maybe it doesn't exist anymore.

SI's swimsuit edition? Nothing but pandering to the male gaze. it's always been an "ick" for me. No different than what Dunne does, except she's in control of what she puts out into the world, rather than SI photo editors.

 

[wishfulgoddess]

I typed out a long response to this a couple of times yesterday, but didn't post them because I just couldn't figure out how to put my concerns into words. I'll try again. Basically, I don't care if she chooses to use sex to sell herself. Livvy is an adult woman who can make that decision. The fact that she does it in a way that involves a direct association with NCAA gymnastics rubs me the wrong way. The fight to get past the "little girls in pretty boxes" stigma aound women's gymnastics has been a long, hard road and the battle is ongoing. We've made great strides and more and more people are beginning to see women's gymnastics as a legitimate and respectable sport, and I feel like it is counterproductive to emphasize the image of the "sexy gymnast". It might not bother me so much if she were promoting her image as just "Livvy Dunne: influencer" as opposed to "Livvy Dunne: NCAA gymnast". Making that connection between sex and gymnastics is the part that gets to me. In the words of kids these day, it gives me the ick. When athletes pose for things like swimsuit issues and stuff, I don't generally have a problem with it because I usually get the feeling that the message is "hey, I may not have the typical body of a model, but strong athletic bodies can be sexy, too". I see that there is quite a bit of hypocrisy there on my part, but it just feels like the message behind the two situations is different.

As for her opinion on scoring, it sounds like she is jealous of those who get 10s and she knows that she will never be able to earn one herself based solely on her mediocre gymnastics. She would need to have the judges just hand it to her.

 

[Big_rock_show]

Meh, I feel like it’s the price of some NCAA that keeps fans from becoming super fans. If the price is so high that you can only afford to go to a meet or two per year, you’re obviously not going to be in the stands every weekend screaming your lungs out.