2023 Pan American Games MAG Team Final and individual Qualifications (Saturday, October 21)

[irichluck21]

 

[irichluck21]

He was beautiful except the fall. 14.466 with the fall wow

#1 qualifier with the fall.

 

[Rich]

#1 qualifier with the fall.

yeah and NEDOROSCIK Stephen qualified. hopefully redemption.

 

[Bogwoppit]

Super happy with this podium.

 

[blake]

Arthur Mariano is the most likely to get the Olympic spot as long as he does similar to today in AA final. I think Mayol could sneak in there if Arthur has an off day. I like that they’re basing it on AA final.

Are they using normal FIG age rules? I think they should’ve allowed next year’s seniors to compete since it’s the only continent holding their qualifying championship in 2023. Angel Barajas won AA silver at Junior worlds this year, and could’ve challenged Mariano here, but now he’ll have to hope that he could make it through the world cups.

 

[RedBirdie]

I’m absolutely enraged that FIG approved PAGU’s qualifier being Pan Am Games, which excludes gymnasts who are Paris eligible. Utterly fucking ridiculous.

But par for the course from a sports governing body that can’t even track reserve athletes correctly. These idiots couldn’t organize an office happy hour.

 

[MaryClare]

I’m absolutely enraged that FIG approved PAGU’s qualifier being Pan Am Games, which excludes gymnasts who are Paris eligible. Utterly fucking ridiculous.

But par for the course from a sports governing body that can’t even track reserve athletes correctly. These idiots couldn’t organize an office happy hour.

Who does it exclude?

 

[RedBirdie]

Anyone born in 2008 for WAG and 2006 for MAG. They’re not allowed to compete here, denying them to opportunity to compete for the AA quota spot. They’ll have to try to qualify to Paris via world cups, which is a much more expensive proposition.

For MAG it’s particularly egregious, imo. Current world junior silver medalist Angel Barajas is ineligible for Pan Ams but will be eligible for Paris.

 

[MaryClare]

Anyone born in 2008 for WAG and 2006 for MAG. They’re not allowed to compete here, denying them to opportunity to compete for the AA quota spot. They’ll have to try to qualify to Paris via world cups, which is a much more expensive proposition.

For MAG it’s particularly egregious, imo. Current world junior silver medalist Angel Barajas is ineligible for Pan Ams but will be eligible for Paris.

I see. This has been the case for a while though? Didn’t the whole Kylie Dickson situation arise because Belarus had a promising junior who wasn’t turning senior until 2016? I’m sure that was the basis of it but then she got injured and Dickson got to keep the spot.

 

[RichardL]

I see. This has been the case for a while though? Didn’t the whole Kylie Dickson situation arise because Belarus had a promising junior who wasn’t turning senior until 2016? I’m sure that was the basis of it but then she got injured and Dickson got to keep the spot.

Yes, this is what happened.

I do miss the days when the gymnasts who were eligible for the Olympics could compete at the previous years’ Worlds, especially since Worlds (and of course same-year continentals) play such a huge role in Olympic qualification. This certainly hurts 15-year-olds from non-qualifying teams.

 

[Passion]

I do miss the days when the gymnasts who were eligible for the Olympics could compete at the previous years’ Worlds, especially since Worlds (and of course same-year continentals) play such a huge role in Olympic qualification. This certainly hurts 15-year-olds from non-qualifying teams.

That was the point. FIG didn’t want 16 year olds at the Olympics. Grandi wrote in one of his letters that dropping the grandfather rule would essentially raise the age of gymnasts at the Olympics to 17+. Grandi wanted to raise the age to 18 across the board but there wasn’t enough support for that yet.

Somewhere along the line they had to compromise with holding qualifiers in the Olympic year, but that wasn’t the original plan.

 

[RedBirdie]

I see. This has been the case for a while though? Didn’t the whole Kylie Dickson situation arise because Belarus had a promising junior who wasn’t turning senior until 2016? I’m sure that was the basis of it but then she got injured and Dickson got to keep the spot.

My issue is that continental and world cup qualifiers are supposed to be an option for those who are not age eligible the year before the Olympics. PAGU is the only one doing their qualifier this early. 2006 MAGs and 2008 WAGs on every other continent have to chance to compete for the AA quota spot. It’s grossly unfair that athletes from the Americas are denied that.

Plus, for 2020, FIG made PAGU schedule a qualifier in that year, not allowing them to use a 2019 competition to award quota spots. (Nevermind the wrench that was Covid)

 

[RichardL]

That was the point. FIG didn’t want 16 year olds at the Olympics. Grandi wrote in one of his letters that dropping the grandfather rule would essentially raise the age of gymnasts at the Olympics to 17+. Grandi wanted to raise the age to 18 across the board but there wasn’t enough support for that yet.

Somewhere along the line they had to compromise with holding qualifiers in the Olympic year, but that wasn’t the original plan.

But it doesn’t accomplish the 17+ goal for the Olympics at all, except for teams that fail to qualify at Worlds. Just ask Kyla Ross, Laurie Hernandez, Angelina Melnikova, etc. So it gives those teams more athletes to choose from in the Olympic year while preventing others from qualifying themselves.

 

[Passion]

But it doesn’t accomplish the 17+ goal for the Olympics at all, except for teams that fail to qualify at Worlds. Just ask Kyla Ross, Laurie Hernandez, Angelina Melnikova, etc. So it gives those teams more athletes to choose from in the Olympic year while preventing others from qualifying themselves.

I’m just telling you what was written in the letter. He specifically wrote that removing the grandfather rule would mean the age at the Olympics would raise to 17+. The point of me bringing that up is to illustrate what the FIG was thinking when they decided to stop allowing 15 year olds to compete as seniors for qualification. Per Grandi’s letter, it was to purposefully make it more difficult for 16 year olds be present at the Olympics.

His goal was for Worlds and Olympics to be 18+. Grandi didn’t want Ross, Hernandez, or Melnikova at the Olympics either. He just didn’t have the support for an age limit increase. So he took what he could get: no 15 year olds at Worlds would mean less 16 year olds at the Olympics.

I mean at the time every country could participate at Worlds. I can’t remember exactly the year they decided to remove the rule, the last year it was used was '07 but the decision to axe it was made well before then, so I’ll use 2003 Worlds as an example. 2003 Worlds had 35 teams competing on the WAG side. Only 12 teams are going to the Olympics. That’s a lot of 16 year olds from non-qualified teams you’re knocking out if there’s no additional qualifiers after Worlds (which there wasn’t when this plan was hatched.)