Figure Skating Thread (Olympic Spoilers/Discussion starting at post #16)

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ArnoldRimmer said:
The most controversial EF medal with a fall I can remember is Li Shanshan on beam in 07. It was a real novelty then.
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I didn’t love Cheng Fei still medaling in 2008 with her vault-to-her-knees. They downgrade if you are a 1/4 twist short but that was probably 1/4 short of flip but no downgrade?

Back on topic, are we taking bets on whether there will be any consequences for notRussia or the coach or even the skater? Cuz…I’m thinking they’ll be “we’ve tried nothing and sadly, there is nothing we can do, let the games go on.” And then bring on the doped up super-children who are weaned off their drugs as they start to compete internationally.
 
I absolutely agree that the lack of transparency in gymnastics scoring has been an issue. It would be nice for athletes to see where they were taking deductions so that they could improve in the long run. Frankly it wouldn’t even be that hard to implement to have a system where the routine was keyed in and judges add their deductions. Just add one person to the panel to add technical data. Elements wherein there is disagreement (degree of turn completion, etc) could be flagged for review as judges go through and enter their deductions after the routine, which, if entered already and if they did their notes well shouldn’t take long. Having the specific elements flagged might even reduce time needed for judges’ conferences.

Even better would be a way for athletes to get feedback on why they lost tenths, but I suppose knowing what is the first step. (Also why I think coaches should at least sit in on some judges courses, though… there’s no excuse for not knowing some of the basics. Looking at Tom here. And Tim.)
 
makam said:
I didn’t love Cheng Fei still medaling in 2008 with her vault-to-her-knees. They downgrade if you are a 1/4 twist short but that was probably 1/4 short of flip but no downgrade?
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Yes! this one is the most outrageous to me as well as sacramone did two perfectly good vaults, you can’t even argue that cheng’s vaults were so much better than her
 
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The one thing I like now that FS does is the score box in the corner telling us what each thing is worth and approximately what score the person got on that thing. And if the thing is going to be reviewed. Only thing better would be if they then put the full chart of scores up instead of having us watch the skater futz around in the kiss and cry.

It is probably too hard to translate something like that to gymnastics since a lot of the scoring is not discrete elements but combinations of them. And they happen a lot faster than figure skating tricks do. But it is too bad because I think something like that would help people follow along. I also think that how they display the scores on NBC does a disservice too because they could be leaning into the “perfect 10” bit with the E score. And if the announcers were a little more knowledgeable or allowed to, they could pick one element from a routine and actually tell us what they think the deductions are for that (.1 for wobble, .1 for body position, etc). I’d rather have that than “scenes from the chalk bucket” or “saga of the ankle tape”. The fact that the judges on this site can generally get the same scores that the official judges get, gives me confidence in the authenticity of the sport. the PCS bit for the figure skating (and some of the spreads in awarded points I’ve seen in the scores in previous Olympics) makes me question the entire sport.
 
I just have to say that it’s really annoying when some figure skating fans themselves mistake PCS for artistry. Artistry is only one part of the PCS.
 
A lot of figure skating elements are combos, though. You see the more obvious jump combos such as “4 toe + 3 toe,” etc… but the spins and step sequences are also essentially combos made of different positions or steps. ChCoSp4, for instance, means a combination spin with a change of foot, level 4. To get level four you need four features, such as difficult position variations, a position held for at least 8 revolutions, a visible increase in speed, a flying feature mid-spin, etc… I imagine an equivalent label in gymnastics might be a series with flight B+C+C or somesuch, which could be labeled “SrFlBCC”
 
Yeah, that was very frustrating. That vault was a mess from start to finish. Cheng Fei always mangled the half on technique, but she just didn’t have the block to reliably get the 1.5 twists in by Beijing. I’ve just been rewatching now, and I don’t think I’d ever noticed before how close her feet are to the table in the postflight. Doubt she was ever in much danger of kicking it, there’s nearly a foot of distance, but it goes to show how lacking her technique was by that point. The height and length just weren’t there.
 
KristyJ said:
combos made of different positions or steps. ChCoSp4, for instance, means a combination spin with a change of foot, level 4. To get level four you need four features, such as difficult position variations, a position held for at least 8 revolutions, a visible increase in speed, a flying feature mid-spin, etc
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The judging geek in me loves this!!
 
The street rhythms selection for the rhythm dance was a missed opportunity. I appreciate the ISU encouraging something more contemporary and less eurocentric. But the skaters picked frankly bad music selections. On the plus side whitest of white people Madison Hubbell and Zachary Donohue successfully merged Janet Jackson with skating. Good job.
 
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what is the reason that Russian Anti Doping gave for overturning her initial suspension?

Presumably those will be the same grounds that Russia will use when arguing at CAS.
 
I haven’t read anything yet as per why, but I would assume it would have to be compelling since they had to have to known it would be challenged.

Does the IOC and everyone else know their defense or will that also maybe come out during the CAS hearing and subsequent decision?

Honestly this whole thing is bringing back awful Raducan memories…. Maybe Valieva’s protected status won’t see her dealt the same fate.
 
This seems much more nefarious than Raducan. Hers was a sudafed. It’s not like you can buy this drug over the counter. Even Valieva had to know that she was taking it (although she may have been told it was a vitamin or something).
 
Katerina Witt said that everyone associated with Valieva should be banned for life. I could get behind that penalty. NGL, I’d rather they lose the team medal too to get Canada on the podium, but if the answer is that the coach and medical staff are never allowed near a rink or a figure skater again, well…the coach hasn’t been shown to be the best guardian of children anyway and abusing kids to get a performance out of them is gross. (though knowing russia she’d be “banned” like Maggie Haney is “banned” so I guess it wouldn’t be much of a punishment…)
 
I just don’t understand on what grounds the suspension was lifted.

Even a completely innocent, non-negligent, presence of a banned drug, gets you at least a year. Unless they can show that she was poisoned by someone outside of her circle, or the B sample came back clean (and thus rendering the A sample invalid), I cannot think of any other reason why she should be allowed to skate.
 
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I agree that the coaches, nutritionists and doctors should all get life bans - the training centre seems to have a huge history of " brilliant" very young skaters, who live away from parents, who become world beating at 14/15 and end up retired at 17/18 with injuries and eating disorders-

There is a long line of abuse here - they boast that the kids eat nothing but “powder” diets - I guess now we know what is in the powders!
 
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