2025 - 2028 WAG COP - A Deeper Dive

[Concorde]

Some of this is... extremely prescriptive. Four expressions only? Beautiful and well-executed choreography getting a deduction because a portion of the routine doesn't include complex choreography even if it is artistically pleasing?

1. I agree with you regarding the limited categories of expression. I also think some of the 'codification' of certain choreographical elements is unnecessary. For example, a gymnast that shows a ring position in her choreography can be subject to the insufficient amplitude of leg swings deduction if the position does not satisfy the criteria used to evaluate actual ring elements(e.g. foot to crown of the head, sufficient arch, etc.). However, not meeting these criteria doesn’t mean that a beautiful body shape can’t be created. A gymnast should have the freedom to not bend the back leg 135 degrees in choreography if it better suits the music. Finally, the 0.1 for releve for a single instance of poor releve in the entire routine is overly harsh.

2. To clarify the Zhao Yaqin example:

- Assuming she shows sufficient complexity in the routine overall, the simple passage itself would not result in a deduction for lack of complexity. You can see this in how they evaluated Kaeslin’s routine. They highlighted the fact that she had a mix of very complex and simple choreography, and that the overall package was sufficient to avoid the deduction.

- I do think it is important that the WTC emphasizes that beautiful and well executed choreography is not necessarily complex. In other words, a gymnast that does simple choreography can still tick off all the other items on the artistry check list, but she will be penalized for the lack of complexity. Conversely, a gymnast that shows complex, but poorly executed choreography will not be deducted for lack of complexity. However, she will be deducted for not satisfying the remaining criteria on the checklist. I do think it is fair to question whether or not the checklist sufficiently rewards quality.

 

[Doug1233]

Facial Expression (Four expressions of Angry, Fear, Happy, or Sad)

If you ever needed a brief summary of the absurdity of the COP, this is it.

 

[Doug1233]

Finally, the 0.1 for releve for a single instance of poor releve in the entire routine is overly harsh.

You could use this to absolute DEATH.



I have at least 3 here, if I am being picky.

 

[Doug1233]

This whole "artistry by numbers" annoys the fuck out of me. The E Panel have enough to worry about. Create an A Panel and add an artistry bonus based on holistic XYZ criteria. 0.0P through 1.2-1.5P. It's basically what the E Panel do now anyway. In practice - there is just no way that the E Panel are judging per this rubric. It's all just a judgment call on a scale at the end of the routine.

You could even just move all the current artistry deductions into a separate additive bonus panel, taken by separate judges who are qualified in dance (in fact, not having a gymnastics background would be a great qualification to be an A judge). I am sure they can find ten or so qualified Ballet/Dance professionals and teach them to evaluate artistry without needing any knowledge of the gymnastic elements.

 

[Sanzhirovka]

You could use this to absolute DEATH.



I have at least 3 here, if I am being picky.

IIRC, during the recent European Gymnastics webinar on BB / FX artistry, Patrick Kiens said the deduction is only taken once. As in, there are no gradations on how well releve is throughout the routine.

The impression was that if there is only one poor execution of it, take the deduction. And then stop woryying about it if it's bad later in the routine, that deduction has already been taken.

 

[Concorde]

IIRC, during the recent European Gymnastics webinar on BB / FX artistry, Patrick Kiens said the deduction is only taken once. As in, there are no gradations on how well releve is throughout the routine.

The impression was that if there is only one poor execution of it, take the deduction. And then stop woryying about it if it's bad later in the routine, that deduction has already been taken.

Yes, this was also my understanding based off of what is presented by Kiens in STS, along with examples where a beam routine shows multiple instances of poor releve, but is only assessed 0.1.

 

[Concorde]

Artistry - Part 2 (Focus on Floor Exercise and Musicality)

A. Harmony

To demonstrate harmony, a routine must develop an identity between the gymnast, the movement, and the music. The routine should say, 'This is my music', 'Look at me', 'This is my exercise.'

B. Dynamics

A gymnast demonstrates changes in dynamics by showing contrasts in energy, power, speed, and intensity of body movements according to changes in music.

C. Body Expression

• Body expression allows the audience to understand the gymnast's character, attitude, and emotions.
• It should be the union of strength, beauty, and elegance of movements.
• Ample movement of the body segments with movements convey character, show feelings, emphasize accents, create amplitude
• Examples:
  • Excellent in Both Categories
    • Ksenia Semenova, 2009 European Championships
  • Very Good in Body Expression and Good in Facial Expression
    • Alison Faure, 2019 Junior World Championships
  • Good in Body Expression, Incorrect Facial Expression
    • Maellyse Brassart, 2022 World Championships
  • Good in Body Expression, Sometimes Missing Facial Expression
    • Angelina Melnikova, 2021 World Championships
  • Fair in Body Expression, No Facial Expression
    • Petra Furac, 2022 World Championships
  • Poor in Body Expression, No Facial Expression
    • Shang Chunsong, 2015 World Championships

D. Complexity

• Complexity is determined by how the gymnast uses the music(rhythm, melody), floor space, and directions involving different body parts in harmony with the music
• The presentation had exercises where you counted the number of body parts that moved during a choreographical segment, along with how many movements per body part
• Examples:
  • Sufficient Complexity
    • Vanessa Ferrari, 2020 Olympics
  • Insufficient Complexity (0.1)
    • Olivia Kelly, 2022 World Championships
    • Kim Bui, 2020 Olympics
    • Aleah Finnegan, 2023 World Championships

E. Corner Choreography

1. Corner choreography must combine music, amplitude, and elongation.

2. Lack of Variety

• Defined as when there is not a different final leg position in each corner

3. Poor Corner Choreography

• Defined as when arm and body work does not demonstrate expressive movement in connection with music OR gymnast shows a different leg position without choreography

4. Deductions for Corner Choreography

• Only deduct for EITHER Lack of Variety or Poor Corner Choreography. Do NOT deduct for both.

5. Examples:

• Very Good
  • Lilou Viallat, 2023 Junior World Championships
• Good
  • Emma Malewski, 2022 World Championships
• Lack of Variety
  • Shin Solyi, 2021 World Championships
• Poor
  • Maria Kharenkova, 2019 World Championships

F. Additional Examples

1. Connection with Music

• Excellent
  • Pauline Schaefer, 2016 Olympics
• Good, but sometimes focused on acrobatic lines
  • Mandy Mohamed, 2020 Olympics
• Fair
  • Samira Gahramanova, 2022 World Championships
• Poor / Background Music
  • Un Jong Hong, 2016 Olympics
• Assessed 0.1 (Accent of music in relation to the movements is missing in a short part of routine)
  • Olivia Vaettoe, 2023 World Championships
• Assessed 0.2 (Different parts of routine where movements and music are not matching)
  • Emilie Winther, 2017 World Championships
• Assessed 0.3 (Music and movements do not match at all)
  • An Chang Ok, 2019 World Championships

2. Expressive Engagement According to Style of Music

• Adequate / Good
  • Ruby Evans, 2023 World Championships
  • Mari Kanter, 2023 World Championships
• Very Good
  • Hanne Degryse, 2023 Junior World Championships
• Zoe Tsaprailis, 2023 Junior World Championships (Could have better facial expressiveness, good body language, movements and movements in harmony with the style and energy of the music)
• Alba Petisco, 2023 World Championships (Good facial expressivness, body language, intensity of the performance in harmony with the music)

3. Involvement of the Body Parts

• Very Good
  • Maria Tronrud, 2022 World Championships
• Insufficient
  • Jasmin Mader, 2016 Olympic Test Event
  • Zhang Jin, 2022 World Championships

 

[Lisaelaine80]

I give up.

 

[RichardL]

I give up.

I feel similarly. I would've thought this was some kind of spoof if I hadn't been completely worn down and exhausted by FIG decisions over the past decades.

 

[makam]

do the actual judges read this and go "Nah, man, I'm just going to keep doing how I was doing it for the last 20 years" or is this nitpicky shit stuff they want and are happy to have to think about? I mean if you really want to hammer a gymnast and have no other mechanism you can get away with, this could do it, but... geez.

 

[RichardL]

The fact that they went all the way back to the 2016 Olympic Test Event to single someone out for "insufficient involvement of the body parts" has me spinning. Leave Jasmin Mader alone!

 

[MLSWAG]

wonders what the angriest WAG FX routine was, because I apparently missed that one, thankfully

 

[Denn]

do the actual judges read this and go "Nah, man, I'm just going to keep doing how I was doing it for the last 20 years" or is this nitpicky shit stuff they want and are happy to have to think about? I mean if you really want to hammer a gymnast and have no other mechanism you can get away with, this could do it, but... geez.

My guess is that the more sycophantic judges will eat this stuff up.

The rest probably are trying to internalize it (like our friend who is doing all the thoughtful summarizing in this thread) because they have to implement it, but also mumbling under their breaths, "This just is too far."

I can tell you that that the American judges are probably going to discuss this and rip it to shreds. And then execute only some of it in US competitions.