Huge Jade FX upgrades

[Doug1233]

I would say there’s a huge incentive to do F, G, H I and J skills on floor, and they’ve left D and E tumbles in the middle, completely pointless unless you’re fulfilling the double salto CR.

Particularly the full in and the double back. If they’re not there for CR, and if you’re not doing whips or a full/1.5 into them, or punch fronting out of them, they’re usually more hassle than they are worth.

I can see why Riley is learning those two big tumbles. They’re both overvalued at H (particularly the Silivas). All she then needs to then do is a front full to a glorious stag, and a bunch of gorgeous split and ring leaps, and some complex dance. If I was coaching her, and I could get her to land those two tumbles, I’d go:

DLO 1/1
Silivas
Front Full - Stag
Split Ring to Split Full
Switch Ring to Switch 1/2
Split Jump 1/1 or Popa

HHC|CCCCC = 5.4

Other than those 2 tumbles, where are the deductions?

 

[irichluck21]

I am sure that is why they are having her training those passes to up the FX value. I just don’t understand it as she isn’t a strong tumbler so why is it being risked?

I guess we shall have to wait and see.

 

[Doug1233]

Someone like Riley should only be doing three passes. Her dance elements are clearly superior. I’ll be mad if they go with 4. Especially if the last one is a double pike/tuck.

 

[irichluck21]

Or just two passes!

If it works for Netherlands and Belgium why not for McCusker ??

Full in tuck mount
Front double full, punch front, stag

load up on clean dance and maximize E score.

 

[Doug1233]

Yes! I would suggest that but I regularly get scolded for watering down too much!

 

[YurchenkoLoop]

Switch 1/1 D
Full-in E
Switch ring + split leap 1/1 CC
Mitchell E
2 wolf D (don’t hate the player, hate the game)
Front double full + front tuck + stag DAA .1
Ring leap/split jump 1/1 C
EDEDDCCC 3.1 + 2.0 + .1 = 5.2

An 8.8 E score seems achievable for a clean routine.

 

[Doug1233]

I agree. And a 14 is a huge floor score. Might make EF (if not for 2 per country).

 

[cats]

The risk for the US girls and that routine style is that you’re screwed if the judges decide to go easy on everyone, which isn’t exactly unheard of in domestic competitions. If they do that at Trials, you’re toast.

 

[Doug1233]

I agree. And I hate that this is even a thing to worry about. Coaches should be able to rely on consistent judging to craft their gymnasts best routines.

 

[JJS_5056]

Judging should be consistent, but shouldn’t there be some risk competing a 2-pass routine at the highest level? I’m not actually advocating judges go rogue, but a COP that discourages learning a Silivas in favor of a Full-In and 2/1+Front is broken. Period.

A > C skills had 0 value until 06. You had to learn D+ skills for a 10.0 SV, and errors could be minimized by .05. Reducing a small leg separation to minor was worth it - on a Full-In (E), you’d net +.15 vs. .10. Now, basic skills are worth .10 - .30, and deductions are -.10, -.30, -.50. When separated legs is -.10 regardless of size (< shoulders), entire elements go extinct. Now, consider a Full-in (E) with flexed feet (-.10) , low chest (-.10), and hop (-.10) = -.40/+.10. A well-executed, HARD double salto (E) = SPLIT JUMP (A)?

Along with the obvious need to overhaul execution deductions (at least, go back to -.05 > -.30 in .05 increments), DV needs to be reassessed. At the Elite level, do A skills really need to carry a value, for ex? IMO, DV should start at C, with a jump to D/E, and another jump to F+, with .05 variation allowed within (Aerial Walkover on BB could be [D, .40], and Onodi [D, .45]).

 

[ArnoldRimmer]

It depends what we mean by risk, I’d say. There is and should always be the risk that someone else turns up able to overcome your execution advantage with superior difficulty. There shouldn’t be the risk that the judges are just not going to apply the execution deductions as the code requires. Imagine if that were the case with the D score. The principle shouldn’t be any different with execution.

Which is not to say any particular code or provision isn’t broken either. But it’s also not good for the sport in general, or the athletes, if it anyone’s guess whether the judges are going to freestyle or not. Additionally, it might also be a quicker way to get rid of shitty provisions if they’re clearly shown to be shitty.

 

[RichardL]

Not to veer off topic, but the opening of the video is an Amanar from Jordan Chiles! Glad that that’s back for her. It should keep things interesting, and also helps to eliminate any chance of Skinner being on the team, now that Chiles seems to be much improved elsewhere.

 

[Doug1233]

Weirdly I think Skinner’s Cheng will score better and be more consistent than Chiles’ Amanar.

 

[irichluck21]

But let’s be honest here. The judges are influenced by other factors as well. McCusker is an established name already. If she is nailing UB and BB she is pushing 15.0 on those events.
I think that if the others were being leniantly scored on FX, a stunning near perfection, routine would also bring in a big score for her. I don’t see the judges going extra hard on her because she has two tumbling lines but everyone else has 4.
Not to mention with tumbling that is easily managed and with minimal deductions, she maximizes on avoiding automatic deductions, which quite often accompany her tumbling, including neutral deductions for OOB. An extremely clean routine will also be a crowd pleaser (small crowd pleaser) so judges will be forced to take minimal deductions.

 

[rue_des_plantes]

McCusker’s just not a “fast” gymnast. She takes those H passes out instead of up and doesn’t rise much. Nothing she does is particularly easy-looking or quick, so huge tumbling and marathon UB/BB combos aren’t the way to go. They’re better off playing the execution card. US judges give her a high 13 when she hits, and she broke 14 at PanAms, so I wouldn’t be too worried about her getting sunk if they scaled back a little.

Jade’s FLO step-out through to Silivas is great. I hope they keep that up for CR, because her other, indirect front passes and dismounts can get sluggish.

 

[Doug1233]

So apparently USAG put out a statement re: Jade and Olympic qualification:

 

[RedBirdie]

I just created a new topic for USAG’s statement! We can discuss there, because, oh boy, there’s a lot to discuss.

 

[irichluck21]

Just further confirmation that USAG is as STUPID as we ALL knew they already were.

They don’t even realize she qualified for VT not FX?? LMAO

 

[tempest]

But let’s be honest here. The judges are influenced by other factors as well. McCusker is an established name already. If she is nailing UB and BB she is pushing 15.0 on those events.

Is she really though? I’m not the biggest Riley fan but internationally, has she ever come close to a 15 on any event? She earned a 14.5 on UB and a 13.77 on BB at Worlds in 18. She got a 14.9 on UB and a high of a 14.25 on BB at PanAms but I’m not sure how scoring was there

 

[rue_des_plantes]

Well, that’s the rub: international judges won’t be deciding if she goes to Tokyo. US judges will be, and they love her when she hits. She’s at or a bit below 15 domestically for hit sets, and her best beam sets are mid-14s with room for improvement.

Major operative here being, “if she hits.” McCusker is hardly the paragon of consistency and she tends to leave tenths on the table even when she does hit, but luckily for her, nobody else is consistent, either.