Post Olympics (September 2024) Articles and Social Media posts

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Ha! some male gymnasts recognize Simone
could take medals in MAG.
Right. But in fairness, as a female gymnast, Simone is in a category pretty much by herself.

As far as her comments on the trans issue I thought Simone's comments were fairly moderate and she showed an attempt to find a way to deal with trans people in sports that would be fair to everyone by saying "Maybe a transgender category IN ALL sports!! " Finding solutions to problems requires being honest and even handed and most of all thoughtful -- as opposed to shouting angry, heated , one-sided mindless one liners. Good for Simone.
 
Yes but it was said to Simone that she wouldn’t have won medals against men.

It’s a much more complicated issue and the rules aren’t addressing the complexity of it. Separate categories or measurements could be used but aren’t. But Riley Gaines would find a way to be sour if she lost against a born-woman. She just wouldn’t be raking in money pandering to the prejudices and anger.
 
It’s a much more complicated issue and the rules aren’t addressing the complexity of it. Separate categories or measurements could be used but aren’t.
Right. But allowing trans women to compete against Cis women is not addressing the complexity either. Simone is the first athlete I know of who has addressed it. As opposed to just shouting and taking one side or the other.
 
Right. But in fairness, as a female gymnast, Simone is in a category pretty much by herself.

As far as her comments on the trans issue I thought Simone's comments were fairly moderate and she showed an attempt to find a way to deal with trans people in sports that would be fair to everyone by saying "Maybe a transgender category IN ALL sports!! " Finding solutions to problems requires being honest and even handed and most of all thoughtful -- as opposed to shouting angry, heated , one-sided mindless one liners. Good for Simone.
Definitely agree the fact that Simone proposed a third category is worthy of discussion.

I've seen commentary on her tweets from both sides of the divide not pick up on the fact that some trans athletes really oppose this, view it as transphobic. It didn't sound like Simone was aware of that, or that when swimming tried one there were no entries.


I've seen a lot of assumption, from people with the full range of views on the subject, that once Simone knows this, she'd be in favour of allowing people to compete in the category of their chosen gender rather than sex.... but she's not actually said that at all. People are filling in the gaps, and as you say, that's quite different to what she wrote.

It will be interesting to see if she says more at any point. I suspect the potential ramifications of having in the same exchange told a five foot five woman that she's man sized might mean she's been advised to leave it for now, as that was not a particularly wise addition to the discussion.
 
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Definitely agree the fact that Simone proposed a third category is worthy of discussion.

I've seen commentary on her tweets from both sides of the divide not pick up on the fact that some trans athletes really oppose this, view it as transphobic.
Right. Look, this is an extremely complicated and uber sensitive issue. I would not expect most trans athletes to be thrilled at Simone's idea of a trans category. But that does not mean it is not the best or fairest answer. Because there is the very obvious reality that a trans woman, especially one that did not transition until after puberty will have an unfair advantage competing against cis women. So the fairness to cis women has to be part of the discussion. Its not a simple matter of what trans people want. Competititve sports have to be fundamentally fair. Or they lose legitimacy.
 
Right. Look, this is an extremely complicated and uber sensitive issue. I would not expect most trans athletes to be thrilled at Simone's idea of a trans category. But that does not mean it is not the best or fairest answer. Because there is the very obvious reality that a trans woman, especially one that did not transition until after puberty will have an unfair advantage competing against cis women. So the fairness to cis women has to be part of the discussion. Its not a simple matter of what trans people want. Competititve sports have to be fundamentally fair. Or they lose legitimacy.
Yes, I don't think it's transphobic either. My point is that Simone doesn't show any awareness of that position amongst some of the people she's purporting to defend, or the previous failed attempt at an open event, and there's been a lot of words put into her mouth about what she'd think if she did. She could agree with your view here, or want categories based on gender identity only, and nothing she's said so far would preclude either view.
 
Yes, I don't think it's transphobic either. My point is that Simone doesn't show any awareness of that position amongst some of the people she's purporting to defend, or the previous failed attempt at an open event, and there's been a lot of words put into her mouth about what she'd think if she did. She could agree with your view here, or want categories based on gender identity only, and nothing she's said so far would preclude either view.
agreed
 
Definitely agree the fact that Simone proposed a third category is worthy of discussion.

I've seen commentary on her tweets from both sides of the divide not pick up on the fact that some trans athletes really oppose this, view it as transphobic. It didn't sound like Simone was aware of that, or that when swimming tried one there were no entries.


I've seen a lot of assumption, from people with the full range of views on the subject, that once Simone knows this, she'd be in favour of allowing people to compete in the category of their chosen gender rather than sex.... but she's not actually said that at all. People are filling in the gaps, and as you say, that's quite different to what she wrote.

It will be interesting to see if she says more at any point. I suspect the potential ramifications of having in the same exchange told a five foot five woman that she's man sized might mean she's been advised to leave it for now, as that was not a particularly wise addition to the discussion.
I had heard the same thing from trans athletes about not wanting a separate category. I think Simone’s heart was in the right place, though.
 
Yes her heart is in the right place. And weaponizing her abuse and abuser against her was a horrible reaction.

A lot of things just can’t be fair to all sides. I’m sure we all see that. Perhaps the most fair thing would be to have a transgender category for competition. No matter who or what is studied not everyone will be happy.
 
I hesitate jumping in here, but I do genuinely wonder what Simone (as arguably the most physically gifted female gymnast of all time) thinks about the issue in terms of fairness and for who.

Also, gymnastics is a really interesting example where the elements and requirements and events are completely different between men and women. It isn't just swimming the fastest, it's almost a completely different sport between the genders.
 
Twitter is designed to promote hateful content against transgender people because of Elon Musk's vendetta against one of his estranged children. It's probably how Simone Biles encountered Riley Gaines' posts in the first place. Biles made a post with the intention of being considerate to other athletes. Sports isn't at the heart or Riley Gaines' posts, i.e. it's not why she has a big audience on the site.
 
I do wish Simone had kept out of this because I don't feel she has a full understanding of the complexities of this subject. She is lucky in that her sport is one where I very much doubt that a trans woman (who had gone through puberty as a male) would ever wish to compete against other women (correct me if anyone is aware of any examples of trans women gymnasts).
It has been totally different to the situation for Riley Gaines in swimming and girls/women in other strength/stamina sports such as basketball, athletics, football, cycling etc etc where the strength and body mass a male has gained during puberty gives an advantage when they then identify, or transition to a woman.

What Simone has said comes from a good place but I feel she is trying to 'people please' about a subject she isn't very educated in.

What Riley has said about Simone and Nassar is crass and unforgivable.
 
Part of the problem with the separate category is that FINA offered an "open" category because they restricted the entrance of transwomen swimmers to the women's events to only if they started HRT before the age of 12. This occurred in 2023 Worlds and not one person signed up. They are open to creating this category in the future.

Part of Riley Gaines and others who have spoken out is about how the NCAA treated the situation. They went to the 2022 Nationals and NCAA had made all locker rooms "unisex" meaning anyone could use the locker room, Lia Thomas, a transgendered woman, and men, meaning any coaches, doctors, trainers, etc could enter the locker room. This was done without athlete knowledge and they didn't know until they arrived to Nationals in Washington.
Some athletes were upset by this and changed in janitor's closets and other closed off spaces.

While there is definitely some transphobia happening, I can also take the point of view of some of the women not comfortable with the locker rooms now being unisex-especially without prior knowledge. Their feelings are valid as well.


NAIGC (NCAA clubs) has a competition already with no gender categories. Woman can do parallel bars, men can do balance beam, for example. Transman Wren Exley of UCLA was named Male Gymnast of the year. I remember watching a cis man compete floor to floor music, I am sorry I can't remember his name. So such non gender competitions are possible.
 

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