Can we do anything for judging transparency?

[gymterweb]

 

[Doug1233]

For a start, they can release the individual judges scores to the public rather than relying on leaks...

 

[Sanzhirovka]

What is the real arugment for more transparency in judging? I mean in term of correct placement of routines. Is there a real concern that gymnasts are not being judged fairly within a single competition?

Arguments that transparency make things better for gym nerds carry no water in my opinion.

As far as I can tell, the vast, vast majority of FIG Brevet judges in WAG and MAG take their duties very, very seriously.

 

[RichardL]

Transparency re: releasing individual judges' scores would definitely be an improvement, regardless of whether or not the aggregate of the total averaging with their peers results in the correct placement. Sometimes it's really interesting to see how an individual judge placed the competition vs. another judge on the same panel, and sometimes (rarely) it's also indicative of egregious wrongdoing or, more generously, a mistake.

 

[Sanzhirovka]

An improvement over what exactly? And where is this call for transparency coming from? From FIG athletes? From federations that feel unjustly scored?

 

[RichardL]

An improvement over what exactly? And where is this call for transparency coming from? From FIG athletes? From federations that feel unjustly scored?

Maybe just from me lol

 

[rlayt]

That Olympic floor final needed more transparency on scores.

 

[rlayt]

Arguments that transparency make things better for gym nerds carry no water in my opinion.

So in your opinion fans of a sport don’t deserve to know how it’s scored?

 

[flappergirl]

I thought that the reason for hidden scoring is so that judge’s country peopled don’t pressure them to score unfairly. Fairness may be better served by releasing the score breakdowns without the names of the judges attached. Then some kind of neutral oversight committee to police fairness.

 

[Sanzhirovka]

That Olympic floor final needed more transparency on scores.

Remind me, because I don't remember that final having anything to do with E scores?

So in your opinion fans of a sport don’t deserve to know how it’s scored?

I might be able to answer that if you break down what you mean - precisely - by "how it's scored". Because I get the sense that you are asking if my opinion is that fans of the sport deserve to know exactly which judge - by name - gave which score. And I guess I see no reason anyone "deserves" that information. And I'm not even entriely certain that information is always impossible to come by.

If you mean something different, could you clarify?

 

[rlayt]

Just speak to it from the standpoint you used when you said “Arguments that transparency make things better for gym nerds carry no water in my opinion.”

 

[rlayt]

 

[rlayt]

For a start, they can release the individual judges scores to the public rather than relying on leaks...

Agree.

 

[RichardL]

I've served on juries for major literary prizes, and when the public knows that you were one of the judges for these prizes, you are subsequently accountable for the rest of your life for that decision. I've done lots of gymnastics judging training and seeing anonymity treasured so dearly on major international panels is really astonishing to me.

 

[ruby]

NOT releasing individual judges scores protects them from being pressured to score a certain way by their federation or friendly federations. Olympic assignments are determined by how you do on a number of designated competitions during the Olympic cycle. If you publish scores, another judge willing to judge more according to the federation's wishes will be sent.

I can't imagine any of you calling for public scores have ever experienced the harassment from coaches disagreeing with you - starting at the lowest levels where it is usually quite obvious what scores you gave.

 

[Bob]

I would totally back releasing the individual scores without names attached.

 

[rlayt]

Judges sit in public at a judges’ table. It’s not much of a step further to release scores without names attached.

 

[KristyJ]

NOT releasing individual judges scores protects them from being pressured to score a certain way by their federation or friendly federations. Olympic assignments are determined by how you do on a number of designated competitions during the Olympic cycle. If you publish scores, another judge willing to judge more according to the federation's wishes will be sent.

I can't imagine any of you calling for public scores have ever experienced the harassment from coaches disagreeing with you - starting at the lowest levels where it is usually quite obvious what scores you gave.

I've had parents run up to me from the stands and try to harangue me for a score (how dare my precious pooh-bear get a low score after five falls!?!), let alone pressure from coaches and gyms and such. I still think that at least making the scores public is the right thing.

 

[rlayt]

Whenever you judges do something with a public component you are a strong person who is willling to stand on your convictions. Anyone can hide behind a screen and pretend to know.

 

[CameliasFingerpaint]

What is the real arugment for more transparency in judging? I mean in term of correct placement of routines. Is there a real concern that gymnasts are not being judged fairly within a single competition?

Arguments that transparency make things better for gym nerds carry no water in my opinion.

As far as I can tell, the vast, vast majority of FIG Brevet judges in WAG and MAG take their duties very, very seriously.

Gymnastics is literally the only subjectively judged Olympic sport that does not release individual judge scores.

FIG’s incompetence is a daily talking point here, I’m not sure why all of the sudden this is a hill worth dying on.